:laughing: nice, good call. Didn't mean on this forum and wasn't really referring directly at your comment but more an overall consensus.Quote:
Originally Posted by VCrossfan
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:laughing: nice, good call. Didn't mean on this forum and wasn't really referring directly at your comment but more an overall consensus.Quote:
Originally Posted by VCrossfan
Here are the latest projects nearing completion. I got around to painting the roll bars, the dash panel and applying the red Durabak liner. It's amazinh how much warm weather makes this possible. I've also painted the roof liner, A pillar plastic, sun visors red (but those are still drying).
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...roll_bar_3.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...roll_bar_1.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...roll_bar_2.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...ear_Area_2.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...enger_side.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...at_in_rear.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...uite_match.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...ver_s_side.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...coordinate.JPG
Couple of pics of the added padding to the interior roll bars. I've got to protect the kids' heads!
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5035.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5031.JPG
Battery Box and interior winch mount
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5033.JPG
Just a little room left over!
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5034.JPG
Had to paint some interior panels to match.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_4982.JPG
Here is how it all looks!
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5030.JPG
Why didn't you just do this to a Jeep? You hacked up a rare VX and just turned it into a big off-roading machine....you stripped everything out of it that made it unique, that made it a real VX. That sucks....another VX gone.
While my personal opinion is that I want to keep my VX with what makes it unique from alot of other off-road vehicles, like the IFS that gives it better handling for rally and on-road applications, I must say that "someone had to do it" to the SAS. Yes this vehicle is now only a VX in body, but I can say, at least that makes it on hell of a good looking offroad machine. As long as everyone does not go this route, I say "hats off", I would not do it to my own, but good work anyways.
I think if you start at the beginning of the thread it makes sense as he started with an abused VX with engine issues. It had been sitting idle for over a year, so in essence it was already gone. Cost more to fix than you would ever get back.Quote:
Originally Posted by VXobsession
Congrats on the build....it's looking good and he's taken a "dead" VX and brought it back to usefulness...hats off!
Yeah, those previous guys can kiss my ***** right in the crack! I've always appreciated the quality of Isuzu vehicles but there are SEVERE limitations as to building it for serious off-roading (not trail-riding). If you are really impressed by V6 engines and IFS, there are a ton of CUV's out there - but you have to compete with the soccer moms too. It is totally the LOOKS of the vehicle that garner it's attention getting. I've retained those looks for the most part inside and out. The fender flares will have to be modified once the clearance issues are worked out.
Why not do this to a Jeep? Well, for most Jeeps, you have to upgrade the: engine, transmission, transfer case, axles, wheels, tires, etc. That amounts to just starting with a Jeep tub and replacing everything else, but then you have another Jeep (again in name only). Jeep tough with Chevy stuff? What is so unique about that?
Mile High is right? Didn't you pay attention to the first pics? I found a VX for $1000 BECAUSE it was severely abused and neglected with a bad engine. Once I decided that 37" tires were my smallest for consideration for my off-roading, then it dictates upgrading everything else in the driveline - including a CSB V8. (I had enough gear-hunting when driving my Trooper on the interstates with 40mph headwinds.)
As I can't drive it 2 miles to a nearby field without someone following me (or pulling me over - thanks Ozark PD and FD) to see what that awesome vehicle is, I think I've got the mix that I want. That is why it is MY build. Go ahead and add an after-market stereo and ArmorAll the panels. You will have an original. There is certainly a crowd for that. I want to get back to serious off-roading, V8, mechanical linkages, solid axles, and large tires! We can park our vehicles side-by-side sometime and see who gets more walk-arounds...
(If you don't like it now, don't check back. By the end of the summer, I will have completed welding classes and will begin adding some armor to the outside.)
I'm cool with the fact he did this to an already beat up VX. If this were to done to a very good/nearmint VX I would be having a serious headache right now. LOL! Its his anyway, he can do what he wants.
Unique vehicles attract unique owners with unique tastes, hence why there are virtually no common aftermarket mods to these trucks beyond the factory cross bars. There just aren't enough of us in agreement on any one given look to make it profitable. As someone said in another thread the front VXC/rowhard faux skidplate is one of the few items that seems to have been a really big hit with a lot of owners.
You can see from the thread that a lot of members disagree with various decisions that have been made along the way, whether philosophical or mechanical. But the bottom line is that this thread contributes to the overall knowledge of the community which is always a good thing. Maybe there aren't a ton of people that would ever consider this entire series of mods, but there are a number of people that say they're interested in V8 swaps and several that have talked at length about roll bars. I applaud the risk taking that makes the community smarter as a whole. :yesy:
sleveritt, great job Mae, looks like a VX on roids :D. Just 2 questions, whats a CUV? and did you just compare ever1's VX to a soccer moms vehicle?
VXObsession, man you're blunt. Not ragging at ya for to each there own, and freedom of speech is beautiful, but dang Mae your more blunt then a rasta.
I love the build, the orange is a little much for me but SAS, V8, roll cage, 37" MT/Rs :drool2:... man you did a ton of cutting to fit those 37s. Totally worth it.
I'm sure your VX looks like a monster. Speaking of which... where are the updated exterior pics? This build thread needs a good shot of your VX to show off the size and tire fitment. :)
It's not really orange, the flash from the camera bleaches it out. It truly is red. It's cloudy today but I will try to get it out in the sun tomorrow to get some exterior shots. As such, I'll still need to take it to a nearby berm to see if I can get any of the tires to contact the body. If so, more cutting on the way (the bottom parts were rusty already). Once the fenders are clear, then I'll have to trim the plastic fender flares to match. Once my axle vents come in and get those installed, then it's break-in time on some mild trails. Increase terrain to make sure everything works well in incremental steps.
CUV = Cross-over Utility Vehicle (car-based unibody)
No, I didn't compare everyone's VX to CUV's. The VX is more like a PUV = Performance Utility Vehicle (SUV on speed)! As to which "performance" you want, to each their own. From my time at 5 previous Zuzoo's in Moab, I was impressed with the out-of-the-box off-road performance I saw, but more could be done. Since I already wanted my current upgrades (even back in my Trooper days) when I discover this "donor" vehicle - a vision was born.
Those other guys were upset because I got rid of the IFS and V6 engine, supposedly the things that make the VX "unique". If that is all those guys were after, almost every CUV have those already and at least manufacturer support as they are current production models. More mainstream for the masses. No style, no unique body. Bland.
As noted, unique vehicles = unique people, don't be surprised by what you see. Look at it, not for you? Move on. Look at it, like it? Make a friend. Bitch about someone else's hard work, piss them off, cause a rift, make an enemy. I dare say members wouldn't act like that at a public event face-to-face, so what makes it acceptable online?
I've been trying to de-orange/red my interior for a while so I thought it was funny that your going in the opposite direction and adding more color. To each his own, I like the idea of going without carpets, I would just rhinoline it black or grey for my own look.Quote:
Originally Posted by sleveritt
Really though your rig is great. I hope to get the SAS myself... someday :yesb:
Looking forward to the Nuke VX pics.
I have a 'mintish' 60K mile VX, and I would have no problem with this being done to it. I really don't see the VX becoming a 'valuable' collectors car. I think it's value from here on will be around the $10K - 12K mark. For even the mintest. (Maybe I'm wrong, I'd like to be) IMO It's still a VX, the body is what makes it a VX, not much else. (being shared components from Troopers, rodeos etc.)
My dream is a 4BT, or Isuzu 4BD1T transplant. I've flirted with selling the VX a number of times (because it doesn't get driven like it should) but I can never bring myself to let it go.
Great Build!
:driver:Quote:
Originally Posted by sleveritt
Love it !
Please continue to add updates, it's amazing !!!
Pretty good amount of droop on this side.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5079.JPG
Some tuck on this side
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5077.JPG[img]
The amount of clearance with this amount of weight on it. This should do for now.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5078.JPG
Here are some pics of just how red the interior really is.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5093.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5087.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5086.JPG
Unfortunately, there are no pics of my VX in action. Sadly, my younger brother had a bit of misfortune both days of wheeling (besides the 105 degree temperatures at Superlift in Hot Springs, AR in July).
So why no pics? The first day ended when he laid his Jeep over in an excessively deep mudhole that ultimately claimed his wife's iPhone 4S that he was using for pictures and videos. If it wasn't for the charging cord, he would have lost the phone all together.
Day #2 was basic wheeling on 3-5 diamond trails the again found my younger brother with his Jeep on it's side. His front driveshaft broke (no 4x4), his brakes were failing, and the radiator developed a leak that about emptied the coolant system. It took most of the day to drag him bag to civilization.
As for my VX, everything worked OK with the exception of some overheating issues. (I'm working on it.) Looks like I will still to perform some fender trimming on the rear as there was still rubbing issues.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_6697.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_6701.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_6705.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_6729.JPG
That thing looks wicked sitting all tall like that!
Have you given any thought to making a list of necessities in doing a swap like this? I'm sure it's massive but maybe a general overview for us interested in it someday. I like the idea of planting a new f-150 4x4 drive line in it, one with the eco boost v6.
Man, that is a crazy VX!!! I love it! Granted, I don't think I would be so die-hard to do that to mine. I think I'm the type of person that would do small mods for now to make it unique to my tastes, but still keep most of the VX in tact. I got my VX from the original owner and he was really easy on it, so I want to baby it myself but still take the trails that it would normally be able to tackle with the gear it already has.
Where did you get those switches from that are showing in the interior next to your steering wheel? I was thinking about doing something like that when I mod in a TOD-off switch.
The list is extensive, yet simple.
Work backwards from tire size.
I did a bunch of calculations before I came to the realization that the tire size I wanted would not work with my axles.
From there, choose axles that will fit reasonably close (Scout Dana 44 just a couple of inches off) or prepare for axle width customization.
Don't forget to figure in where the differentials are in relation to the proposed transfer case (L/R/C front and rear).
Get replacement engine measured to make sure it will fit between firewall and radiator, then between hood and proposed axle height. (This is the time to consider if you want A/C and where you can fit a battery too.)
Get replacement transmission/transfer case measured to make sure it will fit to engine (with or without adapters) and the transmission tunnel.
Fab up some engine mounts and modify transmission support.
Suspension? Coil over springs are quite easy to fab and mount while accounting for shock placement.
Get driveshaft lengths measured to find junkyard or order new ones.
The rest was just customizations - upgrade to chrome-moly axles shafts, ARB Lockers, aftermarket gauges, A/C, Tom Woods off-set U-joints, Warn locking hubs, roll bars, front/rear receiver hitches, winch, etc.
Very cool sir...hats off to you...:bwgy::smilewink:bgwo::bgwo::bgwb:
Those rocker switches come with the purchase of the ARB lockers. One is for pump on, 2nd is for rear, 3rd is front (set to be activated in that order). They have a blue light to show when each is activated.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_5093.JPG
Here ya go: LINKQuote:
Where did you get those switches from that are showing in the interior next to your steering wheel? I was thinking about doing something like that when I mod in a TOD-off switch.
Sick! Thanks, Ascinder :D
Sweet!!!!! Looks awesome and I am sure it outperforms nearly every VX on the rocks and Mudd :-) So what is next?
The push-style fans on the front of the condensor were reading ~750LFM at the front, ~400LFM at the rear, and ~200LFM through the radiator. Importantly, there is about 1.75 inches between the two with little "channeling" of air to the radiator. The bottom has a small lip, but the sides were open.
So I removed the front auxillary fan (not the A/C one) and got to work on these:
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_6759.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_6766.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMG_6777.JPG
Of course, since the install I've not had a chance to go off-roading, the temps will be in the 70's today, but street "driving" showed no signs of overheating. The fit was pretty tight, but there is still ~2 inches of clearance between the fans and the pulleys. We will see...
Sleveritt, I am sorry, but I think you have gone in the wrong direction with this.
The amount of engine cooling you need is directly related to the amount of power the engine is producing.
The fans are there to help the increase air flow through the radiator when you are travelling slowly, or stopped in traffic. At these times, the engine is not working hard, but the radiator still needs air flow. What you have done will possible help in this instance.
But by far the greatest amount of cooling is needed when you are travelling at highway speeds, uphills etc, when you have the gas pedal to the floor.
At these times the fans do little, or no work at all.
The air flow through the entire radiator frontal surface caused by your forward motion is enough to cool the engine.
The cover plate you have installed will reduce this air flow by around 50% by the look of your installation.
Bottom line is that I think you will overheat on extended highway driving.
I hope I am wrong for your sake, but have a plan B for getting home the first time you go for a long drive.
Regards
PK
Did you notice which way to radiator tubes are facing??? I said the front "pushers" weren't working, so I removed one (and only one, leaving the A/C condensor fan), and started working on these (for the rear).
The metal is a shroud from the rear with the fans there. Basic geometry for circles and rectangles proves that without a shroud, you are giving up over half the working surface area of the radiator.
Nice try though!;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleveritt
Okay, think what you like.
I hope it works for you.
PK
Are the dual electric fans still running the full side shrouds? I think what PK is getting at is how can the air trapped by the shroud you made get out. I am sure that the answer is through the fan holes, but if the sides of the fans mount to the rad surface doesn't that in effect create a seal that would hinder air from moving from the aluminum shround area to the holes for the fan? If you plan on mounting the fans to the aluminum shroud instead of the radiator I can see this working, but I'm not sure if you leave the fans mounted to the radiator.
I think chadzu is on to something^^^
I think you guys are not thinkly clearly. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Air enters the front of the radiator either passively (below 185 degrees, the fans are off) or actively PULLED through (above 185 degrees) and exits out the rear. When active, the fans pull air from the entire surface area because of the shroud, blowing the heat into the engine compartment. All of this is exactly like 98% of the OEM market and aftermarket radiator systems. Don't believe me? Check out Griffin radiators or Jeg's or wherever. Bottom line - Shrouds are a must! Check out this month's Four Wheeler magazine too.
Also, the fan is not directly against the fins. I just laid them on there to get a feel of the overall dimensions. The fans come with little springs to keep the separation about 3/4 to 1". Thereby drawing air from the entire shrouded surface area, again just like OEM. I bet you didn't even notice the weather stripping holding the shroud even further out either. It can be seen best near the bottom tank.
PK, you really need to rethink your logic. You have two contradicting statements - "But by far the greatest amount of cooling is needed when you are travelling at highway speeds (NOT TRUE AT ALL), uphills (TRUE)etc, when you have the gas pedal to the floor.
At these times the fans do little, or no work at all. The air flow through the entire radiator frontal surface caused by your forward motion is enough to cool the engine (THIS PART IS TRUE)."
Again, Four Wheeler has a great article if things still seem unclear or try Pirate4x4 - Bella Vista's The Cooling Bible.
Good on you Sleveritt. Stick to you guns.
35 years as a mechanical engineer designing (among other things) all sorts of cooling systems for engines, transmissions, gas turbines, and hydraulics, should have taught me a couple of things about cooling and air flow.
Just have the guts to let us know the real results when you do a long test drive through the hills.
And as I said before - good luck, I hope it works for you.
PK
The back side of the radiator on my SVO is shrouded just like what you're building, except the fans sit side by side it's basically identicle. My fans are on a manually operated switch, and at cruising speed I never ever have to turn them on. What your building should work so long as the fans plastic base don't create a seal and by what you've said they shouldn't.
So PK, does that mean that the ENTIRE automotive industry is wrong because you can't understand that I've replicated the same setup on my rig? If so, then enlighten us with your ground-breaking NEW design that is completely different!!! I'd like to see somone on here become a millionaire! Did you even visit any of those websites or read that article?Quote:
Originally Posted by PK
Anyone here (besides the guy that looked under his hood) go outside and check under their hoods to see if there aren't fans and shrouds ON THE BACK of the radiator? Well, I did. Both GM products have the same setup (save my diesel has a mechanical fan).
Or perhaps, PK, you can "man-up" and admit that you mis-interpretted my setup.
I'll stick to my position and bet money on it. Want to put a nominal amount of cash where your mouth is?
I think the problem (at least for me) was I was going on your pictures in which the fans were sitting on the radiator. That is why I was agreeing with chadzu.
FF dynamics agrees with PK. :yesy:
FF Dynamics sell their electric fan conversions with a smaller shroud. When I asked about the shroud being 2" short on each side of the radiator, this was the reply I received.
Quote:
Hi Jon,
You received the correct size for your radiator, we do not build custom shroud kits that cover the entire radiator core, we only cover enough of the radiator for maximum fan efficiency and maximum cooling. If the shroud was to cover the entire radiator, air flow from normal driving would be obstructed and the vehicle would overheat on the highway. By leaving enough of the radiator exposed around the shroud there will be no high pressure areas and air will freely blow through the radiator without obstruction at speeds faster than 30 MPH. But rest assured, this system has been tried and tested over the years and it will cool your vehicle without any problems what so ever. All of our fan systems are built for maximum efficiency across the board, from cooling, to gas mileage to performance.
Any other questions, just let us know.
Thanks!
FFD
Thank you VXorado.Quote:
Originally Posted by VXorado
I never wanted this to become a p*ssing contest, just some friendly advice.
I have no problems at all with the fans being behind the radiator, and having a shroud. In fact, a shroud is a must.
It is the amount of radiator that you are blanking off that will have no effect on how the fans work, but will seriously restrict the amount of air flow through your radiator at highway speeds.
Whatever you end up doing, I hope it works for you.
If you end up in Moab next year, I hope we can shake hands and have a beer as we look at your rig.
PK
Well, different companies having different techniques I guess because my diesel shroud is enclosed all the way around (diesel mechanical fan though) and on a GM SUV, as well. Trust me, these are on-highway vehicles only. I was going on what I saw in my garage and what I read for OFF-ROADING:
Four Wheeler Magazine - "Keeping Your Cool: Cooling System Tech"
The fan shroud should cover as much of the radiator as possible. Don’t be afraid to trim the fan shroud slightly to clear the water inlet or outlet. Do make sure that the shroud seals against the radiator all the way around. It’s ideal to have the fan motor mounted 1 to 2 inches away from the radiator, although some tight situations call for a low profile fan setup like the one shown here.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...n_radiator.jpg
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...fan_shroud.jpg
Then Griffin radiators (King of the Hammers sponsor) has this from the Cooling Bible
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...516_resize.jpg
As you can see, no gaps whatsoever, but these are off-roading designs. And really, when you look at my rig what is the first thing that pops to mind? How many highway miles does it drive or how much fun it is to off-road that thing? This is our third vehicle and only intended as "inclimate weather use" and off-road. I got a diesel and car hauler for extended trips. (Nothing made me sweat more than driving the Trooper 1200 miles to Moab, then off-roading it for several days while hoping I didn't break some unique expensive Isuzu part that would prevent me from driving the entire family back home and getting back to my job.)
Also, I've not got the steering monster figured out yet. Still have a constant drift the the right requiring constant turning to the left - even while driving a straight road. Adjusted the aluminum bumpstops to prevent the tires from rubbing the sway bar and track bars. Kept the axle on stands, kept tires off, ran the engine and it didn't move after 15 minutes of idling. Alignment is good on all three axis and squareness. I'll have to keep testing (same thing after driving several miles, maybe street tires, maybe new upgraded PS pump)...
Sam
Man, some people sure do get testy with a little friendly critiquing! After looking closely at all pictures offered, I would be a little concerned too about not only the percentage of the radiator that your fans cover but also the angle of your shroud face in regards to directing air to the fans. The picture of the Griffin radiator shows fans that cover 75% of the rad surface with a stand-off shroud. The pics of your rad shows fans that look to cover considerably less area and appear to be flat mounted to the rad core. Now, I realize that you have rectified that assumption earlier, but the images do tell a different story. If you are new to the whole custom build thing, it is hard to get used to people second-guessing your every decision, but get used to it; even the pros get second guessed by their peers...Don't take it personally. I wish you the very best of luck with your build and hope you can sort out all the details to your satisfaction and don't stop posting!! (Even if you do take some heat for your decisions.) :_brickwal :_beer: