**Patriotic Retirement**

[don moore]

i love this new USSA......

[tomdietrying]

This may be the reason why we are in the situation we are in.

Here is a glimpse of how two people think. Two men were asked how they thought history would see them.


Respondent #1 – “Fellow citizen, we cannot escape history, we of this Congress and Administration will be remembered in spite of ourselves. No personal significance, or insignificance, can spare one or another of us. The fiery trail though which we pass, will light us down, in honor or dishonor, to the latest generation.”



Respondent #2 – “History. We won’t know. We’ll all be dead.”







The two respondents are George W. Bush and Abraham Lincoln. Here’s my question to you. Which man said which statement?



I’ll bet you a million dollars you got it right.



Send this to your friends and win a million dollars too!



Peace.
Tom

[Marlin]

Once you have the million dollars, I have a friend in Nigeria that is actually a prince and needs some money, could be a great investment, I heard we are sending some as part of the stimulus(partially quoted from SNL).

[HOT_WASABI_JUNKIE]

Actually...
We have been sending billions to Iraq and all we have gotten back from that is about 4500 flag draped caskets...not a very good return on our investment.

[Marlin]

Actually...
We have been sending billions to Iraq and all we have gotten back from that is about 4500 flag draped caskets...not a very good return on our investment.

Really? The common person in Iraq would completely disagree...but you wouldn't understand cause you live in sunny Southern California, and preach from your laptop without ever sacrificing anything(unless you really are that retired military Senator hidin out in your office).
As far as the money goes, you cleverly forgot to mention the billions in [B]FOREIGN[B] aid that Obama pledged in addition to what they already got that is going to places like Egypt, who conveniently vote against the US in every UN vote. Good thing we need to give away more money to non-americans beyond the ones that actually showed an effort to get here, even it was illegally.

[HOT_WASABI_JUNKIE]

Really? The common person in Iraq would completely disagree...but you wouldn't understand cause you live in sunny Southern California, and preach from your laptop without ever sacrificing anything(unless you really are that retired military Senator hidin out in your office).
As far as the money goes, you cleverly forgot to mention the billions in [B]FOREIGN[B] aid that Obama pledged in addition to what they already got that is going to places like Egypt, who conveniently vote against the US in every UN vote. Good thing we need to give away more money to non-americans beyond the ones that actually showed an effort to get here, even it was illegally.

Ya got me!
I for one couldn't give a §hit about the citizens of Iraq! they will be pointing our own guns at us the minute we leave. If they hated Saddam so bad, they should have ousted him themselves! At that point we could have joined in. Iraq was all about W and his small penis.He could not bare the thought that saddam threatened to kill his dad! I'm sure his friends in Saudi Arabia ( the country that did attack us on 911) told Bush that Saddam made them nervous...and we all know that Bush was in their back pocket as well.
I have said it before, the billions of dollars, some never even accounted for, could have been best spent here...where it was made and where it would have done the most good...can we really afford to build schools in Iraq when our schools are falling apart? Halliburton may say yes but I say no...
I pay taxes too...that's my sacrifice...So I get pissed when our money goes out to nation build for all the wrong reasons....We installed the shaw in Iran...do you recall how well that went?
Here to throwing good money after bad on a country of muslims who will never have our back!

[tomdietrying]

Marlin,
How many common folk died over there because we went in because of WMD? Did you ask them that question? I believe the figure is about 650,000men, women and children. On top of that, how many lives have been affected because of those deaths. Remember, Iraq had nothing to do with 911.

You cannot dispute the facts about Iraq and sound intellegent. I've praised you for doing a fantstic job carring out your mission as a soldier. You did what a soldier is supposed to do. I don't know maybe it's your way of coping with having to come home and some great men did not. If that's the case, I apologize for my words. But to sugar coat what we did over there is frankly a lie and unamerican. I'm not living the lie anymore and I will not support the lie any longer.

Peace.
Tom

p.s.
You never told me what kind of beer you drink.

[HOT_WASABI_JUNKIE]

Marlin,
How many common folk died over there because we went in because of WMD? Did you ask them that question? I believe the figure is about 650,000men, women and children. On top of that, how many lives have been affected because of those deaths. Remember, Iraq had nothing to do with 911.

You cannot dispute the facts about Iraq and sound intellegent. I've praised you for doing a fantstic job carring out your mission as a soldier. You did what a soldier is supposed to do. I don't know maybe it's your way of coping with having to come home and some great men did not. If that's the case, I apologize for my words. But to sugar coat what we did over there is frankly a lie and unamerican. I'm not living the lie anymore and I will not support the lie any longer.

Peace.
Tom

p.s.
You never told me what kind of beer you drink.

Oh, great warrior, hmm? Wars not make one great....
Master Yoda

[Marlin]

Marlin,
How many common folk died over there because we went in because of WMD? Did you ask them that question? I believe the figure is about 650,000men, women and children. On top of that, how many lives have been affected because of those deaths. Remember, Iraq had nothing to do with 911.

You cannot dispute the facts about Iraq and sound intellegent. I've praised you for doing a fantstic job carring out your mission as a soldier. You did what a soldier is supposed to do. I don't know maybe it's your way of coping with having to come home and some great men did not. If that's the case, I apologize for my words. But to sugar coat what we did over there is frankly a lie and unamerican. I'm not living the lie anymore and I will not support the lie any longer.

Peace.
Tom

p.s.
You never told me what kind of beer you drink.

I am not so naive to believe WMDs had anything to do with it. A military base in the middle of the Gulf makes much more sense so that we are not entirely dependent on any one Middle Eastern nation as an ally. Same reason we own Hawaii, Guam, Wake Island and the bases in Japan as well as South Korea and so on, in which there are thousands of US military stationed, but we don't bitch about that cause its been so long. Call it imperialism, I am ok with that. Thats what it takes to be the most powerful nation in the world.

I appreciate your appreciation, (not sure if that makes much sense), but always remember, we are a 100% volunteer military force, so no sugar coating required, I would expect a similar response from a cop or fire fighter, risking our life is part of our job and we are all well aware of it. We do it to protect EVERYONE in America, even those who fight so hard to destroy it and undermine everything that our forefathers fought for, but that is their right. I believe that as a society, we are beginning to lose touch on what it means to be an American, we were not founded by peace loving hippies, or people who believed life should be fair, that is called socialism. We were founded by people who buster their *** to build a life for themselves with no help from anyone else, and they were willing to die and/or kill for what they created.
If you do anything, please, do not forget that. I agree with Wusabi on that point, *F* the rest of them, they are on their own, but to think we have done no good in Iraq is insulting to everyone.

I am not sure 650K is accurate, but imagine the millions that must have died before we got there at the hands of that psycho murderer Hussein while working on his genocide. Maybe we shouldn't have gotten involved in WWII either, but Kurds, Jews, eh, they weren't Americans...leave them to the tyrants.
PS- I like Sierra Nevada...as much as I hate SoCal, I love that beer, and its too expensive here, if it doesn't support a NASCAR, its considered an import here in the South.

I am done ranting about this, none of us will ever change the other's minds, but man, is it fun to try, better than tip toeing around trying to not offend anyone, that is just gay.

[Osteomata]

Really? The common person in Iraq would completely disagree...but you wouldn't understand cause you live in sunny Southern California, and preach from your laptop without ever sacrificing anything(unless you really are that retired military Senator hidin out in your office).
As far as the money goes, you cleverly forgot to mention the billions in [B]FOREIGN[B] aid that Obama pledged in addition to what they already got that is going to places like Egypt, who conveniently vote against the US in every UN vote. Good thing we need to give away more money to non-americans beyond the ones that actually showed an effort to get here, even it was illegally.

Well I agree with his statement, and I have served as long as you have, or longer.
- Os

[Osteomata]

I am not so naive to believe WMDs had anything to do with it. A military base in the middle of the Gulf makes much more sense so that we are not entirely dependent on any one Middle Eastern nation as an ally. Same reason we own Hawaii, Guam, Wake Island and the bases in Japan as well as South Korea and so on, in which there are thousands of US military stationed, but we don't bitch about that cause its been so long. Call it imperialism, I am ok with that. Thats what it takes to be the most powerful nation in the world.


I am not sure 650K is accurate, but imagine the millions that must have died before we got there at the hands of that psycho murderer Hussein while working on his genocide. Maybe we shouldn't have gotten involved in WWII either, but Kurds, Jews, eh, they weren't Americans...leave them to the tyrants. .

Well at least you cop to being a neo-colonial imperialist. But the real insult is comparing the WWII to our ridiculous misbegotten adventure in Iraq.

- Os

[Gussie2000]

Well at least you cop to being a neo-colonial imperialist. But the real insult is comparing the WWII to our ridiculous misbegotten adventure in Iraq.

- Os

And counting .............

[Osteomata]

And while Im all fired up, the 650K Iraqi casualty figure is indeed controversial. The Lancet study that sites that number did not restrict itself to known deaths caused by war related violence, but also included demographic based estimates that include mortality rates associated with war-related conditions such as drought, famine, disease, lack of access to health services etc. Hard core confirmable deaths related to violence might be less. But there are also studies that suggest the figure is over a million.

The Kurdish genecide in Iraq, while I may not think it comparable, is indeed horrible. If you are suggesting that such a genecide is/was a legitimate justification for OIF and the follow on occupation, I can accept that. Nothing you have said in this thread would lead me to believe that is your primary, or even important consideration, but if you say so, so be it. But using this logic I must assume that you also believed that we should have unilaterally invaded Rwanda to prevent that tragedy, and should be in the Sudan now. Or is the humanitarian justification nothing more than a convenient post-fact rationalization?

- Os

[Gussie2000]

The facts about iraq is that GB & commitee use 911 to launch a war agains the arab world because of israel,you guys knows that,the 911 was the perfect excuse to do so.

Is a fact that israel use the US to protect them,even though we all know that what israel has done agains the palestine people is close toa holocaust.

Just because hitler & his nazis reich did kill millions of inocent jews doesn't mean that israel has the right to kill inocent palestine people & remember that hilter didn't just kill jews,he also killed gays,black people,arab people & any race that didn't had "PURE" arian blue blood running thru their blood stream.

The real meaning of liberty & democracy is let others live & let them find their path to it,we as citizens living in this country don't allow others to address us how to run our way of live & if we want to be considered a country with good people who believe & have faith in freedom then we must start proving that by respecting others opinion just as how we do right here with each others.
It's shamefull that we keep yieling "We the people believe in FREEDOM" & keep forcing other countries to do what ever is convinience to us.

[pbkid]

can we really afford to build schools in Iraq when our schools are falling apart?

thats my biggest issue with 'the war'....why are we spending every last penny on other countries while our own falls apart??