National ID Cards - Coming Soon to Your Wallet

[mbeach]

- the possibilities are limitless.

Exactly.

[transio]

Exactly.

So we should eliminate any technology that could potentially be used to infringe on our freedoms or harm us? Ok, then add to your list the Internet, computers, telephones, airplanes, automobiles, gasoline, nuclear power, medical research, SSNs, driver's licenses, cameras, and weapons. Scrap 'em all. Weapons are the one thing on that list that don't have a single beneficial use in society. Ironically, it's people who cry about freedom infringement who fight the fiercest for the maintenance of weapons in society "to protect themselves". The bottom line is that if a technology is more beneficial than detrimental to society then it's worth considering implementation of it.

[Mr. I-MAN]

WyrreJ

Go to Canada I'm sure they don't have those kind of cards there, and you can hang out with the rest of the ex-pats, draft dodgers and criminals who found the American system just too hard to deal with. Hell they love your kind up there.

[Moncha]

[Tone]

Dang, I finally agree completely with I-Man! Lots of complaining in the USA but try going ANY PLACE ELSE and report back how you like it.

[TYGVR]

Why didn't they put a gps chip (or give them a choice to) in everyone who is working in the war regions overseas. That way if they are kidnapped they can find them sooner. With the last years episodes of kidnaping I think everyone would like to be tracked. Kinda like "Snake Pliskin".

[mbeach]

Go to Canada I'm sure they don't have those kind of cards there, and you can hang out with the rest of the ex-pats, draft dodgers and criminals who found the American system just too hard to deal with. Hell they love your kind up there.

It was kinda funny until we got here.

I was a Paratrooper in the Army for 11 years.
I have served as a consultant for a defense contractor, and I've worked for the Dept. of Homeland Security.
I have also guarded some of our nations most secret technology at a Government research facility.

I have sweat blood and watched some of the finest men I'll ever know, die in service to this land (and you, who have never served anything greater than a dinner, armchair Generals). So if I want to criticize our (my) government's use/misuse of technology, then by God I will. I have earned it.

This bill, if approved and implemented, rubs even my strict conservative fur the wrong way. If it doesn't set off some mental alarm, than you're just not paying attention.

[DK]

[I was a Paratrooper in the Army for 11 years.
I have served as a consultant for a defense contractor, and I've worked for the Dept. of Homeland Security.
I have also guarded some of our nations most secret technology at a Government research facility.

I have sweat blood and watched some of the finest men I'll ever know, die in service to this land (and you, who have never served anything greater than a dinner, armchair Generals). So if I want to criticize our (my) government's use/misuse of technology, then by God I will. I have earned it.

This bill, if approved and implemented, rubs even my strict conservative fur the wrong way. If it doesn't set off some mental alarm, than you're just not paying attention.[/QUOTE]


This reminds me of the story of the frog in the pot of water. The heat slowly rises and the frog doesn't realize it's in trouble until it's too late and it's boiled alive.

Who are these guys that want so much control over us and what are their motives? From what I've seen them do to lie us into a war that has cost over 1600 lives of our military, 10,000 or more injured, and will end up costing us at least a half a trillion dollars -- all, as it has now been documented, based on lies and manipulated intelligence -- I sure as hell don't want these incompetent SOB's in charge of a national database that, if they don't screw it up completely, has ever chance of being misused.

Let the games begin.

[transio]

I was a Paratrooper in the Army for 11 years. I have served as a consultant for a defense contractor, and I've worked for the Dept. of Homeland Security. I have also guarded some of our nations most secret technology at a Government research facility.

Awesome. Great credentials. Here are mine; I've been a database programmer with specialization in personal information directories for many years. One of the central metadirectory databases I helped architect and build was for a [big three auto] security / time tracking database for its million or so employees at 100 or so International facilities.

I have sweat blood and watched some of the finest men I'll ever know, die in service to this land (and you, who have never served anything greater than a dinner, armchair Generals). So if I want to criticize our (my) government's use/misuse of technology, then by God I will. I have earned it.

Is it your contention that those of us who have not served in the military have not "earned the right" to have an opinion on the matter? No one is telling you that you have not got the right to an opinion. We're telling you that we believe your opinion is wrong. Try to recognize the difference. And I don't care if you are a former president, you are not right to imply that your credentials make you any more entitled to your opinion than anyone else here.

This bill, if approved and implemented, rubs even my strict conservative fur the wrong way. If it doesn't set off some mental alarm, than you're just not paying attention.

Why?

This reminds me of the story of the frog in the pot of water. The heat slowly rises and the frog doesn't realize it's in trouble until it's too late and it's boiled alive.

Actually, it was a TV commercial.

Who are these guys that want so much control over us and what are their motives? From what I've seen them do to lie us into a war that has cost over 1600 lives of our military, 10,000 or more injured, and will end up costing us at least a half a trillion dollars -- all, as it has now been documented, based on lies and manipulated intelligence

What does the war have to do with an ID card?

I sure as hell don't want these incompetent SOB's in charge of a national database that, if they don't screw it up completely, has ever chance of being misused.

LOL yeah, I'm sure they'll get George Bush to program it instead of hiring someone like me to do it. He's got nothing better to do with his time anyway, right?

With all your bitching and moaning, I don't see a solid argument anywhere in there against the technology.

You have not presented one negative about the technology. Only made blank assertions like "it infringes on our rights" and "it takes away our freedom." In short, your argument is baseless, essentially saying "I'm an expert because I used to carry a gun. I don't like this technology mumbo jumbo. They can turn us into drones."

Y'all have been watching too many movies. It's a F***ing ID card for christ's sake.

[transio]

Why didn't they put a gps chip (or give them a choice to) in everyone who is working in the war regions overseas. That way if they are kidnapped they can find them sooner.

Brilliant idea!

[mbeach]

...except that a GPS antenna would also have to be implanted, as well as a power source.

I do love the "Escape from ________" movies though

[kpaske]

I generally consider myself to be a privacy advocate. I believe the right to privacy is one of our hard earned rights as American citizens, and I don't like the idea of giving up any of my freedom. On the other hand, I do agree with Tone and the others who've said that those who have nothing to hide have little to lose by these types of technologies.

The new bill, as I understand it, is not exactly a national ID card --- it standardizes some of the features of state ID cards so that they can be universally recognized. The only thing that is really being added for sure is a national ID number (the equivalent of a SSN), a universal electronic scanning method (mag strip or possibly RFID) and possibly a biometric like a fingerprint.

The electronic scanning is what I think bothers so many people because it makes it easy to collect data on individuals easily and electronically. I do object to the idea of RFID scanning because that gives people the ability to collect your information without you knowing. This is a BIG deal. The idea of a mag strip or bar code or other electronic scanability does have some potential privacy consequences because it allows others to easily collect and store your information. Of course, laws could be written to prevent certain people from collecting or storing certain information, which would probably be a good idea, but this is unlikely to happen because that's how the government would track the criminals.

I think a lot of people are making jumps that don't need to be made right now, but maybe some of these things are inevitable. Once the technology is there and accepted by the public, it makes it so much easier to move into all these other technologies that would violate our precious privacy.