FYI for those people with overheating issues with their VX

[rocket man]

Hi Everyone!!

I am an original owner of my VX with 235,000 miles on the clock and just now working on the 3rd radiator. Also, I know a little bit about auto repairs as I owned an auto transmission repair shop for many years. There has to be a difference between an OEM radiator and the typical aftermarket radiator.

The OEM original I had failed on me about 4 years ago, the plastic crown cracked. We just bought an aftermarket over the counter. I didn’t pay much attention to the old core just threw it away.

But there has to be a big difference. I never noticed, with the OEM radiator, this slow creeping up of the heat gauge in hot weather and on a steep grades. I even pulled a 16 foot Komfort Lite trailer 1000’s of miles mostly between Montana and Los Angeles. Never ever a heating probem with the OEM.

I was immediately dissatisfied with the after-market radiator. Yet, most (95%) of the time it was okay but the heat gauge seemed to wander alot more, whereas the OEM seemed to nail the needle just below midway point on the gauge consistently no matter the weather or load. So I started poking around on the internet and found a “two row” after market radiator on Ebay from a local distributor here in LA. I ordered it ($100 seemed pretty cheap to me) and 1 day later it was delivered. First of all, it was NOT 2 rows, second of all it was a exact duplicate of the aftermarket one I had in there already! Never paid much attention to it in the first time install, however this time we scoped it out closely. It’s a skinnyass radiator. I called the distributor and he said, “2 rows” was a typo and this was the only radiator available. I said, okay and I sent it back and they refunded my money, no problem. I didn’t need it because the “one row” radiator I already had in there was working ok. So I began to wonder if some of the VX owners with this gradual overheating on grades, etc. had an OEM radiator or the inferior type aftermarket version?

Now, fast forward to last week.. Boom! Cracked plastic crown in an almost identical place that happened to the OEM unit 4 years earlier. This is a regular drive so I needed the car pronto. I ordered a new one from another Ebay distributor. It came 2 days later. The box said, “American Eagle Radiator Company”… but my suspicion is it should say, “Chinese Buzzard Radiator Company”… It is an exact copy of the one we took out. Not just a little bit close but is exactly the same. BTW this is a very simple install even without a hoist. 10mm socket, 1 blade 1 Phillips head screw drivers, 2 feet of 3/8in power steering hose, 8 hose clamps( I use 8 cause I’m paranoid 4 will work) , one gallon undiluted anti-freeze + wawa. 1 hour or less install. I replaced the trans cooler line hoses too.

So far it works fine, but I don’t trust it. I know that a few VX owners have installed Ron Davis radiators and if possible maybe could kindly chime in here and report on how their all aluminum radiator works in this hot weather? I’d Like to learn more about it and how I would go about getting an exact copy of the radiator like, I think, VX Kat has. As I recall they are around $650.

Thanx
John

[VX KAT]

.
I find it really interesting SO MANY of us are now having O/H problems....maybe it's just time for certain age parts to die...


My recent experience with new RD radiator in heat in Moab:
http://www.vehicross.info/showpost.p...6&postcount=16


On trip to Vegas last week for the photo shoot, my temp gauge was all over the place...so frustrating....

• Air temp consistently 95-100.
• Consistently going 65-75mph...so plenty of air flow!
• Temp climbed going up big hills with A/C on.
• Temp went down some with A/C off, but took quite a while to return to normal, even when going DOWNhill.
• Sometimes I had to turn heater on...that was pleasant..., but it lowered it.
• Fluid was low, added 1/3 gallon 50/50 on return trip. - Seemed to reduce frequency, but not always.
• When slow or not moving, temp went way up. Going super slow around a block in Vegas with those crazy mobs, it skyrocketed and I pulled off into a hotel drive.
• Twice it pegged on the white bar on H.
• Twice pulled off to shut her down for a little while. Helped very little, would start to rise within minutes.
  
• It clearly acted INCONSISTENT...would rise when just going on flat straight-away at 70-75.
• Made it home OK, talked with mechanic next day.
• Doesn't think it's thermostat since that's most likely to be a CONSISTENT problem...when mechanical thermostat goes, it's gone...wouldn't expect inconsistencies.
• Spun fan with engine cold, seems somewhat restricted, but I'm not sure.
• Decided to replace fan clutch.
• Merlin advised there's been a redesign and you now HAVE to buy the new style fan clutch (~$250....OUCH ) AND a new fan blade (~$100....OUCH again)...
• Arrived today, will get installed next week.
• Fingers crossed....
• Even with all this, I have NO regrets getting custom build...it's way cool, and it will give me more opportunity to have A/C on in hot weather (which is uber important to me...it's an MS thang)....we just gotta figger out what's not workin' right!
• Repeat warning Bill gave me: NEVER use any coolant additives such as Purple Ice in this radiator..will eventually erode and leak.

Detailed specs on my Ron Davis radiator-

• Has more cooling capacity than OEM
• No plastic parts, all aluminum
• RD Part number 1-24RO9397
• Can call Bill Williamson at RD and order it with that number. He's SUPER helpful and explains everything in great detail.
• About $600.
• Bill Williamson
  Ron Davis Racing Products, Inc.
  7334 North 108th Avenue
  Glendale, AZ. 85307
  Tel- 623-877-5000 Ext.16
  Fax- 623-877-5001
• http://www.vehicross.info/showpost.p...72&postcount=5

MORE specs on my RD radiator:

• http://www.vehicross.info/showpost.p...2&postcount=25

Thread on aluminum radiator build:

• http://www.vehicross.info/showthread...ight=ron+davis

[vt_maverick]

There has to be a difference between an OEM radiator and the typical aftermarket radiator.

I think the main difference is that one is designed to outlast the manufacturer's warranty period (4 year 50K miles I think?) while the other is designed to last for the typical aftermarket warranty period, which is generally much less. It's simple business sense, aftermarket manufacturers have to sell for way less than OEM or nobody would buy them, so naturally they have to cut corners during manufacturing and can't offer the longer warranties.

Not that dealerships don't mark their parts way up anyway, I'm just saying that the system is perfectly designed to achieve the results you're seeing.

[blacksambo]

The more I read the more I respect Isuzu OEM parts.

[Etfren]

Just like Sue, my VX was overheating on the Top of the World trail in Moab this year, and has done the same on hot days climbing long hills here at home too, so I've been trying to come up with a solution for this too. I've got 2 10 inch electric fans in my rig but they don't seem to be any better (or worse) than factory, besides not having to worry about my fan clutch exploding again.

An idea my dad brought up and something I have been thinking about recently is mounting a sprayer system to mist the radiator with water to help cool it a little extra. I believe the STi (Wormgod want to chime in?) has a factory setup for this to spray cool water on the TMIC to help with heatsoak issues.

At least one of the top drift racers in Forumla D has a setup like this on his car to keep from overheating between runs because they spend a lot of time just sitting on the grid waiting. Other teams just carry a sprayer like you would use for weed killer and spray it down that way between runs.

[VX KAT]

Just like Sue, my VX was overheating on the Top of the World trail in Moab this year, and has done the same on hot days climbing long hills here at home too, so I've been trying to come up with a solution for this too. I've got 2 10 inch electric fans in my rig but they don't seem to be any better (or worse) than factory, besides not having to worry about my fan clutch exploding again..

Eric I didn't recall yours was doing it too...I remember MeowMix's was, and saw her hood up during our lunch break. Fan clutch exploding?...I musta missed that story!
I still can't believe so many VXs are now having this problem....all at the same time...?

[rocket man]

Wow that is a bewildering dilemma you have VX Kat. That is a crazy maker.

I have a 89 Isuzu Amigo that I have also have had since new. Now in that one I had a two row (like yurs) Modine radiator put in years ago to cool down the little 4 cyl engine that just couldn’t handle pulling that trailer. After the install I could pull a bus up Pike’s Peak and it wouldn’t push the needle past the middle of the gauge.

That radiator of yours is the, “bomb” and should way way way over cool your engine. IMHO. But since it doesn’t….. from the description you describe I would take a real hard look at your thermostat. At 60-75 mph you should be getting plenty air through the radiator so that you really don’t need any fan at all. Personally I don’t think if you R&R the fan clutch and fan it will make any difference. Seems to me that your “inconsistent” engine temp variations are consistent with a thermostat that won’t fully open and restricting your coolant flow.. Another thing to me that points to a stuck thermostat is that you basically have same issue that you had with this new radiator that you had with old one… yet it has to be 25-50% more efficient. Yet you mentioned you noticed a little drop in the engine temperature when the heater was turned on… and that was only running through a teeny heater core with fan on. That water is running right out of the block through the heater core to make a noticeable difference in your temp gauge. If the “stat” is half closed or a quarter closed it amounts to a significant restriction that even a big "Mondo" radiator like you have can’t overcome. JMHO

It was 97 degrees in Santa Clarita today and I was chugging up down hills and it was nailed at just below midway on the gauge with the A/C on. And that’s with an “el cheapo” very thin non-oem cooler that I have no faith in for the long haul. I know from 1st hand experience it’s a pain the @#$ to change this part but I’d take a hard look it anyway. If you do end up swapping out the thermo be sure to order the little seals and “o” rings from Merlin once you get the plenum chamber off.

Good luck Kat

Oh yes and BTW thanks for all your links on your radiator... Im gonna get me one of those...
Thanx
John

[JHarris1385]

Out of everyone overheating are most of you watching the gauge on the dash or does anyone have a Scangauge and have actual temp numbers?

Mine does not reach past the half way mark till somewhere around the 210s+

[Skydoo]

If everything temperature related has been ruled out, it is time to check the circulating aspect of the system; pump is not as efficient as before, worn out belt or gear, internal blockage etc..

[Etfren]

Eric I didn't recall yours was doing it too...I remember MeowMix's was, and saw her hood up during our lunch break. Fan clutch exploding?...I musta missed that story!
I still can't believe so many VXs are now having this problem....all at the same time...?

Yup, it was pushing to the top of the gauge, and Mark's VX wasn't too far behind me in overheating either. He had a Scanguage, but I forget what temp's he said he was getting up to.

Yeah, my fan clutch was going bad (didn't look into why it was so loud until after it went) and must have locked up or something because it broke the mount for the fan in half and shredded most of the belt when it went. Didn't feel like messing with replacing all that stuff, so I had my mechanic swap in the electric fans.

[VX KAT]

Wow, thanks for all that detail rocketman. Mechanic also suggested new OEM thermostat, so that goes in next week too.
JH..I don't have a scan gauge, so relying on dash gauge....it has crossed my mind the gauge could be malfunctioning. I recall someone mentioning that possibility in an older thread, think it was Mark (MSHardeman).

Since so many have recently had the fan clutch die, I decided to replace, even though it's lower on the possibility list.
I can't really hear the fan, and read two owners said they could really hear a difference after replaced.....and I liked the idea of getting the newer design. Figure it's likely better, not worse.

Mechanic will be checking for other possibilities as well next week.

Interesting to see all 4 out 5 of us on Top Of The World had the same problem, (anybody know if Jon had problems too?)
It wasn't THAT hot..maybe 92-93....but the trail sure was much rougher, and therefore, slower than 2 years ago.

[rowhard]

I too was having overheating issues, had been noticing prior to rad, water pump, timing belt change along with some other stuff. this that the temp gauge seemed high normal. Hooked up the scan gage after parts change sure enough, was as high as 218 under normal driving during the one week of hot weather here. Was dreading the thermostat change then read the tread about the fan clutch. More money, (150.00 new) but could be a easy fix. Sure enough, temps running no higher then 184 and normally in the 170's since change. So, moral of the story, do the check on your fan clutch to see if that might be the cause.

[VX KAT]

Got the new fan clutch, fan blade and thermostat installed.
Merlin advised a redesigned OEM fan clutch is the only one available now, and requires a new fan blade as well. New fan clutch is now $250 and blade $100... OUCH! Old fc was around $70 IIRC....

Interesting, new fan has 9 blades, old has 11. Blade shape and curve are also very different. I didn't measure either of them, but visually, it looks like there may be more surface space on the new blade, but not sure.

Like a few others said, I think I can hear more roar from the fan when the A/C is on, compared to before....but not a huge amount.

I thought for sure the new blade wouldn't fit in the old shroud, but it did, mechanic said it was tight. And Dub's tread plate cover could stay as well.
If this solves my O/H problems, I guess I'll never know if it was the new clutch or JUST the new blade....hmmmm

Let's hope the redesign means more air!

Going to make a Phoenix run in a few days when it's supposed to be 102. Going to try to really tax it on one steep section of I17 where the elevation rises about 2000 ft in about 2-3 miles, with full A/C going and see what happens. There's warning signs to turn off A/C, and big rigs and regular cars often overheat and are pulled off to the side.

I'm curious, anybody know why the blade arrangement on both have one space between blades that's larger than all the others?

[evillecutter]

looks like it would push much more air

[Scott Larson]

[QUOTE=VX KAT;265369]Got the new fan clutch, fan blade and thermostat installed.

I'm curious, anybody know why the blade arrangement on both have one space between blades that's larger than all the others?


I'm guessing it has something to do with accoustics, making it quieter...