Funny sig line graphic....

[ZEUS]

So apparently, even childish over-simplifications aren't enough? It doesn't take a rocket-scientist to figure out comments such as these stem from threads like the "hello world" thread, but the subject being discussed there wasn't about hurting anyone's feelings, it was about seeing things from another viewpoint and realizing that even well-meant suggestions (using the search function) can be viewed two different ways.

I personally can't help but see the irony in it being implied by veteran members that a newb is lazy for not using the search function, when veteran members could be viewed as just as lazy for not using his/her knowledge to conduct what should be a quick search based on terminology now known to them to provide an example to a newb of what to search for as it relates to a VX.

Maybe the next search should be for the "give a man a fish vs. teach a man to fish" concept?

Given the number of Ford F-150's rolling around, that site may very well have to deal with an unusually high number of repeat "dumb" questions, but as a website dealing with a substantially lower number of prospective members, shouldn't VX.Info hold itself to a bit higher standard?

Hey Trek... you again... HAHA j/k.

Because you mentioned the "Hello World" thread, I just searched for it and opened it for the first time. I originally knew what the topic was about because I previewed the first post so therefore had no interest in opening it. There in itself is the issue with an individial not searching for topics that have been covered countless times - there is an inherent stance to 'help those who help themselves'... or simply pay no attention... or the urge to tell them to help themselves. However, I was kind of surprised to see the turn that thread took and now understand why you mention it here. Had Sue not covered it so handily new guy may not have had his questions answered and could have turned against the site...? Kudos to her for taking the time to better the experience of new users and the efficiency of this site. Awesome!

I, however, also have to point out the grabbing of the bull by the horns method of gaining open knowledge versus the grabbing of the bull by the horns method of supplying it. I would say the complaint of an individual not using the search function does not simply apply to 'newbs' of this forum but instead is a hint at an internet etiquette faux pas on a large scale. I think as a whole we (humans) are at the end of the early stages of forum-use evolution and expressing "come on, get with the program" is perfectly legit. In the future, this stance will have hopefully conditioned newbies to search from the outset which will effectively improve our search engines' ability to supply info for all and invoke exponential growth in the clarity of our knowledge base. This should give more strength to 'searching naturally' versus 'asking naturally'... Then again, I have been drinking!

[VX KAT]

Then again, I have been drinking!

But you make so much more sense and your posts are awesome when you are! ...er, emm, well at least I understand them....

[VXR]

Hey Trek... you again... HAHA j/k.

Because you mentioned the "Hello World" thread, I just searched for it and opened it for the first time. I originally knew what the topic was about because I previewed the first post so therefore had no interest in opening it. There in itself is the issue with an individial not searching for topics that have been covered countless times - there is an inherent stance to 'help those who help themselves'... or simply pay no attention... or the urge to tell them to help themselves. However, I was kind of surprised to see the turn that thread took and now understand why you mention it here. Had Sue not covered it so handily new guy may not have had his questions answered and could have turned against the site...? Kudos to her for taking the time to better the experience of new users and the efficiency of this site. Awesome!

I, however, also have to point out the grabbing of the bull by the horns method of gaining open knowledge versus the grabbing of the bull by the horns method of supplying it. I would say the complaint of an individual not using the search function does not simply apply to 'newbs' of this forum but instead is a hint at an internet etiquette faux pas on a large scale. I think as a whole we (humans) are at the end of the early stages of forum-use evolution and expressing "come on, get with the program" is perfectly legit. In the future, this stance will have hopefully conditioned newbies to search from the outset which will effectively improve our search engines' ability to supply info for all and invoke exponential growth in the clarity of our knowledge base. This should give more strength to 'searching naturally' versus 'asking naturally'... Then again, I have been drinking!

all this from someone who does not own a vx

[Y33TREKker]

...Topics that have been covered countless times...

From which viewpoint?

Sure, maybe the people that are already here have seen the topics countless times, so the specific ways the topics can be described are by now "old hat" to us...but so what? That has nothing to do with someone new to the VX world.

It's the same on any website specific to a niche item such as the VX. It will have it's own slang terms, and to expect someone to walk in off the street already knowing the slang is simply an unreasonable expectation.

We've heard examples in the two threads being discussed where people have used the search function, and it simply hasn't delivered. Can we not take that as proof that the search function isn't the end-all-be-all answer that will end all veteran member frustration?

It's been tried, "countless times", it didn't work. Chalk it up to another failed experiment and move on.

[ZEUS]

which automatically disqualifies anything you say.........

Shut it, Toy Boy!

From which viewpoint?

Sure, maybe the people that are already here have seen the topics countless times, so the specific ways the topics can be described are by now "old hat" to us...but so what? That has nothing to do with someone new to the VX world.

It's the same on any website specific to a niche item such as the VX. It will have it's own slang terms, and to expect someone to walk in off the street already knowing the slang is simply an unreasonable expectation.

We've heard examples in the two threads being discussed where people have used the search function, and it simply hasn't delivered. Can we not take that as proof that the search function isn't the end-all-be-all answer that will end all veteran member frustration?

It's been tried, "countless times", it didn't work. Chalk it up to another failed experiment and move on.

HAHAHA! By slang terms, I guess you mean "fuzzy hole", "fangs", "horns", "diff drop"... any other examples? Say, something that may actually hinder one's ability to type in the search field: "common VX issues"? Speaking of experiments, maybe you could create a VX glossary for new-comers, for simply complaining about "childish over-simplifications" and not supplying something to resolve the issue at hand implies you have no good ideas; only good observations... and as a veteran of VX.info 'shouldn't you hold yourself to a bit higher standard'?

[Y33TREKker]

...Speaking of experiments, maybe you could create a VX glossary for new-comers, for simply complaining about "childish over-simplifications" and not supplying something to resolve the issue at hand implies you have no good ideas; only good observations... and as a veteran of VX.info 'shouldn't you hold yourself to a bit higher standard'?

I supplied the idea of providing a VX Terminology section that could be added to the already provided idea of a VX Owners Manual.

Given your suggestions, the only idea I've seen you provide is the same one that's proven itself time and again to NOT be the end-all-be-all solution.

It's a group effort. Are you now expecting everything to be provided by others too like those newbs you complain about? Does my power of observation now detect the smell of irony.