Super VXer
So by this theory, reindexing the torsion bar "magically" reduces the amount of force required to lift a given amount of weight (load) to the same height?Originally Posted by SlowPro48
OK, if you say so...
At this point, I'm willing & able to agree to disagree...
Also, reindexed or not, the suspension travel from like heights, through the full available motion (when it hits the bump stop) is the same, creating the same amount of torsional force for a given amount of travel.
Last edited by Ldub : 03/05/2010 at 06:33 AM
Super VXer
The bottom line is that it appears safe to lift 3" using the torsion bar crank (been proven on a fairly large number of our VX's). If you need to go much higher than that though ... better start looking at other options such as a body lift.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Put a smiley after you say that Bub.
Super VXer
HEY! You keep your clear water comments to yourself!
Sent from my "two hands on a keyboard"
Super VXer
Now let's talk about tie rods ... do whatever you want to those ... they never break.HEY! You keep your clear water comments to yourself!
Super VXer
Well actually... with an offset from Hell...
Super VXer
Ldub - I see what you're saying - had to do a little more visualizing there. You're right. I'm wrong. As long as the torsion bar is not pre-loaded to the point where the suspension is topped out, it doesn't matter if the lift is achieved by reindexing or by cranking the torsion bar - when ride height is increased, suspension travel from "baseline" to bump stop is increased - therefore max torque the torsion bar can experience is increased the same amount no matter which method you use. If you crank past the point you're topped out you would increase the max torque seen by the torsion bar, however, as each ft-lb of preload at the top of travel is a ft-lb added at the bottom of travel. But I doubt if anybody would keep cranking after the VX stops going up. There's probably not that much adjustment range is there? You'd have to re-index to do that!OK I gotta get back to my crack pipe now. Thanks for the mental excercise!
Tom - Yeah there's no problem with safety - I wasn't saying that. It's just that the VX won't handle as well if you crank so much preload in that you're riding way higher in the stroke than the designer intended. At three inches higher than normal ride height you're probably not that far from being topped out. When off-road racing on two wheels you want race sag (that would be the equivalent of VX ride height with you and your gear in it) to be set so that you're about 1/3 down into the stroke and I imagine it's a similar setup for best suspension compliance when you're in the four wheel realm too. It's not good for handling/traction if you're topping out all the time. But then I guess the aim here isn't good high speed off-road handling anyway is it? Nobody's running in a rally or a SCORE desert race or anything - they just want more ground clearance to prevent getting hung up and keep from ripping stuff off the bottom of their VX as they crawl over rocks!
Super VXer
Nope - it's all about the big tires.
Go big or go home.
Super VXer
That's mighty gracious of you to say, & truth be told, I was starting to think that I might have been looking at from the wrong end of the pipe...Ldub - I see what you're saying - had to do a little more visualizing there. You're right. I'm wrong. As long as the torsion bar is not pre-loaded to the point where the suspension is topped out, it doesn't matter if the lift is achieved by reindexing or by cranking the torsion bar - when ride height is increased, suspension travel from "baseline" to bump stop is increased - therefore max torque the torsion bar can experience is increased the same amount no matter which method you use. If you crank past the point you're topped out you would increase the max torque seen by the torsion bar, however, as each ft-lb of preload at the top of travel is a ft-lb added at the bottom of travel. But I doubt if anybody would keep cranking after the VX stops going up. There's probably not that much adjustment range is there? You'd have to re-index to do that!
Tom - Yeah there's no problem with safety - I wasn't saying that. It's just that the VX won't handle as well if you crank so much preload in that you're riding way higher in the stroke than the designer intended. At three inches higher than normal ride height you're probably not that far from being topped out. When off-road racing on two wheels you want race sag (that would be the equivalent of VX ride height with you and your gear in it) to be set so that you're about 1/3 down into the stroke and I imagine it's a similar setup for best suspension compliance when you're in the four wheel realm too. It's not good for handling/traction if you're topping out all the time. But then I guess the aim here isn't good high speed off-road handling anyway is it? Nobody's running in a rally or a SCORE desert race or anything - they just want more ground clearance to prevent getting hung up and keep from ripping stuff off the bottom of their VX as they crawl over rocks!
But no matter how I tried to get my head wrapped around how reindexing would change the force needed, I couldn't do it.
IMO, a good discussion isn't about who's right or wrong, it's about getting to what's really going on, & I think we might be there...
Of course, there is still room for further views that might not be exactly the same.
I was kinda hoping that one of our members with a broader understanding of mechanical engineering than I have, would step in & splain it better.
Here's to you, for being a good sport & playing nice...
Super VXer
Well yah...that & lookin' cool az H3II with our "go big or go home" tires, & offset from h3II...
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote