Arrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggg!

[creeg]

The Zune is Microsofts "Ipod Killer".

Any MP3 player that comes in brown, and runs Mircosoft software, no freakin way.

And I build websites for MSFT for a living.

And regarding the DRM (Digital rRghts Management) on Itunes:
Its not that bad, from personal experience.

Zune, on the other hand, has BROKEN DRM on it: if you bought music from the old Mircrosoft music purchasing system (cant remember the name), the DRM does not allow you to transfer your music to the Zune. You have to re-buy the music you already paid for.

I have 2 ipods, and love them. But if you are that set against Itunes, good luck finding anything that has anywhere as nice an interface and is as easy to use.

Bart

what do you (or anyone else) think of those new Zunes?

-cy

[etlsport]

F'd
up
beyond
all
recognition

ahhhh... makes much sense.... these plans were actually 4 plans overlaid on eachother (not on purpose either lol they were definately fubar

[iamjacksadrenalgland]

i have a question ... i rip my own mp3's using Exact Audio Copier to get very high quality mp3's ... are there players that let you store music in variable bit-rate or higher bit-rate formats? all the units i looked at make you convert/compress to their format, rather than just storing the data as is.

[nfpgasmask]

You do have to install iTunes to manage the music library on your PC.

Thats all I really need to know. No matter what, I don't want iTunes on my machine. I have seen the software and messed around with it several times, and quite honestly, I hate it. I have absolutely no issues managing a rediculous amount of music without it. ID3 tags and all, its done simply and quickly, the way I want it.

It will ask if you want it to check, (balance) the sound levels of your files, and it will ask if you want Gapless added to your sound files(before and after silence removed).

Wow, that sounds like iTunes actually modifies your existing files. That's no good.

It will ask if you want it to download album art if you want it to, You can look for artwork on the net and paste it into your files manually if you like.

No need for that, I just want the music.

Print this up and ask them to demo these features at an Apple store, if you have any doubts or questions.

No more questions, just doubts. I think you helped me understand again, that iTunes is not for me, and thus, neither is the iPod. This is the whole problem with most software today, even alot of the more consumer based MicroSoft stuff. The software wants to "automate" and control everything. I can't stand that. If I am not in complete 100% control of what I want it to do, then I don't want it. This is why I have always hated MACs. I know they have come along way since, but the lack of customizablity and tweak-ability always turned me off. To me, it just seems like everything gets completely dumbed down for people who don't know jack about using computers, which is fine, they need to market and sell, but man is it annoying! PCs have always been the advanced way to go, imo. MACs were like the Speak & Spell and PCs were like the TI-80 Graphing Calculator. I say "were" because I know newer MAC OSes are much more "advanced" than they used to be, but still...

When you have iTunes on your computer you can hook it up to your home stereo and have an awesome jukebox or listen to your music as you surf, I do. I also use it as my alarm clock

My computer is my home stereo, and why do I need iTunes to listen to music on my PC? I use WinAmp with no overhead whatsoever. No DRM. Just an EQ and a Volume slider. Perfect. Playlists, Windows shell integration. I couldn't ask for more.

Thanks for the input though, its good to reaffirm sometimes!

Bart

[CrnCnn]

My only chime in here is that my Creative Zen Micro was a POS. I had it for six months and it slowly declined. Never dropped it. All of the sudden my power switch, you know the slider, stopped working. So every time I wanted to turn it on I had to connect it to a computer, because Creative labs would not give me any real assistance for repair, I wasn’t interested in paying 30 dollars for them to just look at it. I am an electronic technician so I asked them to send me a replacement component since the parts were still under the year warranty, and I would fix it myself. NO NO NO is all I got.

I purchased an iPod a couple months ago and like it, I don’t have any issues with itunes. I use mine all day 5 days a week and then at the gym. So we will see if this one lasts longer than the Creative.

Any way, a co-worker bought one that I think is a Dell. I know Toshiba makes some large size hard drive styles. I think their 60 gig was around 150. don’t quote me on that.

I am not interested in the Zune until a few revisions happen because you know the way things work, in 6 months or less there will be new features.

Happy hunting.

Clint

[nfpgasmask]

The Creative players don't care if its vbr or 256. I also use Exact Audio Copy and had no issues with the Creative player decoding the files.

Bart

i have a question ... i rip my own mp3's using Exact Audio Copier to get very high quality mp3's ... are there players that let you store music in variable bit-rate or higher bit-rate formats? all the units i looked at make you convert/compress to their format, rather than just storing the data as is.

[nfpgasmask]

[QUOTE=creeg]

And regarding the DRM (Digital rRghts Management) on Itunes:
Its not that bad, from personal experience.

QUOTE]

Even if it is no that bad, it is bad. I want NO DRM.

Bart

[Bulldoggie]

[QUOTE=nfpgasmask]

And regarding the DRM (Digital rRghts Management) on Itunes:
Its not that bad, from personal experience.

QUOTE]

Even if it is no that bad, it is bad. I want NO DRM.

Bart

Only songs puchased from the iTunes store have DRM rules=
I think it is only four computers that you own may make copies of that song.
I think you are limited to 4 or 5 CD (Aiff) copies you can make.
An Aiff music CD of your purchased music, can be re-imported like any other CD you own as mp3 music files.
This is nothing like the "SONY" DRM; it installs nothing in background....
You are not required to buy anything from the iTunes store to use and upgrade the iTunes software.

[thedutchguy]

I have a samsung YH-925 with 20gig capacity, It's cheap, works fine and it has USB on the go which enables you to store foto's from your digital cam on the player without the use of a pc or laptop.(handy if the memory card on your camera is full)
Its the same size as the current Ipod with same cap.

[Ruflyf]

I think I have already suggested mine in the past Bart, but I am still very happy with my Archos AV-420. Although technically its a mp3 player on steroids. Classidfied as a DVR and mine has 20g (although newer ones go to 80 or 100gig I think.) its very good good for playing music, video, and /or using just as a usb drive. Although I dont know if its been corrected or not, but the onboard speaker is VERY weak. So listening though headphones or stereo unit is pretty much a must. As for the durability I dont know, and hope to not find out, I do have a aftermarket nylon case I bought for it that has a plexiglass shield that covers the screen. Also it has a remote control when its being used in the dock as a DVR but I havent ever used it either.

[kpaske]

I'm with Bart - all of the current incarnations of DRM are bad. When I buy a CD (or if I ever decide to purchase a track online), I want to be able to listen to that track whenever and however I want. In addition, I'm a HUGE fan of convergent technologies, but I don't need products that assume I'm a complete moron - which is what this latest generation of products (Windows Vista, iPods, etc) does. I want to copy, convert and organize my music the way I want it, and I want a CHOICE of software to use, commercial and freeware. I want to try them all and then decide which one works best for ME.

I have an SD card that holds 4GB, and it cost me about $60 on sale. I think the Rio Cali may be limited to 1GB cards, or at least it was when I bought mine a couple of years ago. Newer models or similar models may no longer have that limit but I don't know for sure.

I haven't ever messed with the iPod or Zune or any of these newer devices for the reasons stated above. Every inexpensive MP3 player I've ever played with would operate the way you need it to - if you don't install the software that comes with it, the device will STILL be recognized by Windows XP as a "generic usb drive" and it will be given a drive letter just like a thumbdrive. That's why I say you should just look for one with the features you want - SD slot, long battery life, desired formats (MP3, WMA, ACC, OGG, etc), equalizer, etc. Once you find one you like you can always go down to best buy or circuit city or whatever and have them plug it into a computer right in front of you without installing any software to prove that it will work that way.

[Bulldoggie]

I have 2 ipods, and love them. But if you are that set against Itunes,

good luck finding anything that has anywhere as nice an interface and is as easy to use.

I can't say it any better than this

[MZ-N10]

wat is acutally wrong wiht the player....cause it might just be a dead hd...

[nfpgasmask]

I can't say it any better than this

Well, once again, it has nothing to do with the device itself. I think they are nice looking, and I like the ease of navigation on them as well. Plus, the load of accessories available is also quite nice...

Bart

[etlsport]

bart!! www.woot.com
thers a 5 gig rio like what i have for 80 bucks... for about the next 15 min!