Another Lambo Door Question

Ok ... I've seen most of the postings on vertical/lambo/scissor doors. With my new CD release (myspace.com/onlywon) and my vx being featured on the back of the CD, posters, and the new video set to release later this year (hopefully nationwide), is there ANYONE that's actually bit the bullet and done this? It's got the perfect hip hop image and people in the music industry as telling me it would be a great way to attract even more attention...which is always a good thing in the entertainment industry.

Baldwin (aka: Only Won)

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is there ANYONE that's actually bit the bullet and done this?

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We're letting you be the first! :yesy: :yesy: :yesy: :yesy:

Being the first is waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy cooooooooooooooool. :winky: :winky: :winky:

Survey Seeeeez.....photoshop! ;)

Lambo doors aren't hip-hop. They're cheap puerile ricer. On any car not designed to have scissor doors, the motion to open and close the doors is confusticated. You have to push it out, then lift, and the door bounces around. Then, the door covers up half of the opening, making it a pain in the *** to get in and out of the vehicle. All in all, they're just dumb.

If you want a hip-hop image, get a Chrysler 300 and chrome paint it, or better yet, get a black one and pinstripe it like the Exige Espionage. Hip hop is about looking bling but clean. Not about looking stupid.

If you want vertical doors on the VX, the only way to do it properly is to go with gullwings. But good luck with that, unless you've got $10k+ to dump into the project. ;)

That lotus IS sweet. Hey, hip hop is about bein' true as well as unique. Bling is just a superficial way of telling people what you wanna be. Truth about me is I'm not Bling, but I do have a VX. Points are well taken though. THose hotwheels posted earlier looked pretty good to me. Hmm...would it look stupid to just do 1 door? Probably huh? The thing with the bolt on, if it sux, I can put the door back right?

I'm personally not a fan of Lambo or Gullwing doors. The idea was unique for high-end luxury sport-car toys, but the VX already has a unique futuristic look. If you want to "bling" it out, drop the suspension, put on 24's and tons of chrome, trick out the paint job, recover the seats and panels with the skin of an exotic animal (how about ostrich?), and put a wall of subs behind the rear seat. Look at some of the highly modded VXes on this site and you'll see that you don't need funky doors to get attention from your VX. Just my 2 cents. ;Db;

Baldwin:

I have thought about the Lambo doors myself.. I thought that would be beyond unique.. When you pull up somewhere, and your doors open up, instead of out, people look... People stare. People LIKE...

I don't think some of the members here understand what you are getting at.. You are looking to attract attention, image.. You aren't looking for versatility. The VX is high enough to where the upper portion of the door being blocked isn't going to even bother you anyways... I personally think this is a fantastic idea.

Heed to the warning above about $$.. You will have to take your VX to a custom Mod shop.. I don't believe anyone makes a kit to convert the VX doors. This may be expensive... But I don't see it being more than a few G's..

Please let me know if you find someone to do this.. I would be very interested in how it was done, and how much it was...

Good luck!

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Originally Posted by PDOGG23

I don't think some of the members here understand what you are getting at.. You are looking to attract attention, image.

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I understand, I just think that there are some kinds of attention that you DON'T want in this industry.... i.e. the kind where people are laughing at how stupid you look.

I think your image should reflect who you are, otherwise it will be contrived. If you don't like scissor doors, screw 'em. There are cheaper and better ways to create an image for yourself.

1. Get your cladding smoothed, painted black, and clearcoated.
2. Add yellow skidplates from Ron.
3. Get some 22" black chrome 3-piece wheels with polished stainless bolts a polished lip.
4. Replace the gray inserts on the seats with yellow alcantara inserts and put yellow paint + clear coat on the gray plastics.
5. Or, if the yellow interior bits are a bit overboard for you, you could do black pinstriped cloth on the gray interior parts (leather and plastics) for a classy, sophisticated look like that Lotus I linked to above.
   
   Here's a better pic... look how well the pinstripes work with the black leather:
   
   http://blog.dermk4vw.com/files/autom...espionage1.jpg

Then you've got a well-put-together Proton that will attract attention, but will not look stupid.

Hey Transio, seen this last exige?
It runs on E85 and has 265 HP!
http://www.autoweek.nl/images/800/0/...8fd0b3b420.jpg

I don't see how this really changes the image of the VX - the doors will look the same and many of the kits allow for normal opening in addition to up. I can think of lots of times that kind of door would come in handy. And if you really think about it instead of going with you gut reaction that it is ricer (due to your limited exposure to them in person or in the media) then they very much fit with the VX look and image. I saw a sweet SL500 last time I went to the track and ricer never crossed my mind. I think that is a state of mind and predjudice.

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Originally Posted by transio

Lambo doors aren't hip-hop. They're cheap puerile ricer. On any car not designed to have scissor doors, the motion to open and close the doors is confusticated. You have to push it out, then lift, and the door bounces around. Then, the door covers up half of the opening, making it a pain in the *** to get in and out of the vehicle. All in all, they're just dumb.
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This depends on the kit, quality, and type of car. Some kits are too loose, allowing more movement to swing out. The butterfly look.

If it is done well the doors can be opened completely, straight up, with zero obstruction. This would be especially better in todays small parking spaces were you have no room to open the door.

Also it is not rice it is German and Itailan. I generally think that long thin doors look better vertical, ie Lamborghini Countach, than square but it still look good if done right.

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Originally Posted by Tone

you gut reaction that it is ricer (due to your limited exposure to them in person or in the media) then they very much fit with the VX look and image.

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It's not my "gut" reaction - it's my intellectual perception. Scissor doors and gullwings serve a purpose. They are designed to ease entry into cars that have high & wide sills due to frame components, which are designed to add rigidity to the chassis. The Vehicross has no such frame components. Its chassis is not designed to be rigid, because it's not a race car. Therefore, the purpose of scissor doors is nil, and they don't, in fact, "very much fit with the VX look".

If, however, you were to cut the doors in half at the cladding line and introduce a rollcage/frame inside the bottom half to increase rigidity, and cut your roof in half and make gullwings, then you would be increasing the functionality of the vehicle and creating a purpose for the vertical doors. This is what I plan to do with my next VX.

Understand that the difference is between function and kitsch. One is cool because of how and why it works, and the other is pathetic, because it attempts to imitate the "cool" while providing no functionality, and in fact often decreasing functionality. In the car world, "kitsch" is called "ricer".

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Originally Posted by Tone

I saw a sweet SL500 last time I went to the track and ricer never crossed my mind. I think that is a state of mind and predjudice.

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Are you sure it wasn't a Mercedes/McLaren SLR? That car looks a lot like an SL with a body kit, and has gullwing doors because it's an exotic car with very high/wide sills, and therefore needs them for ease of ingress and egress.

http://www.koenigsegg.com/graphics/i...ive/35_640.jpg
Koenigsegg's Dihedral Synchro Helix doors.

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Originally Posted by JAFO

If it is done well the doors can be opened completely, straight up, with zero obstruction.

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Incorrect. A door that is not designed to open vertically must first open outwards a few inches, then vertically, to clear the frame. Likewise, to close it, you must first pull it down, then inwards to engage the latch. True scissor doors open on a single axis of movement.

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Originally Posted by JAFO

Also it is not rice it is German and Itailan.

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I'm not talking about the invention, I''m talking about the imitation. It is "rice" not because of its origination, but because of its function (or lack thereof)

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Originally Posted by JAFO

I generally think that long thin doors look better vertical, ie Lamborghini Countach, than square but it still look good if done right.

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:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by transio

It's not my "gut" reaction - it's my intellectual perception. Scissor doors and gullwings serve a purpose. They are designed to ease entry into cars that have high & wide sills due to frame components, which are designed to add rigidity to the chassis. ...

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The Lotus Elise has high and wide sills but still uses standard outward swinging doors.

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Originally Posted by transio

Incorrect. A door that is not designed to open vertically must first open outwards a few inches, then vertically, to clear the frame. Likewise, to close it, you must first pull it down, then inwards to engage the latch. True scissor doors open on a single axis of movement.

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I didn't state that it would elliminate all outward movement. Just stating that some kits allow more, making the door seem loose and floppy.

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Originally Posted by transio

I'm not talking about the invention, I''m talking about the imitation. It is "rice" not because of its origination, but because of its function (or lack thereof)

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"Rice" was a term originally used on all Japanese vehicles imported into the U.S. Therefore if you have a Japanese vehicle it is "rice" so how can you say that modifing a Japanese vehicle makes it look "rice"?

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Originally Posted by JAFO

"Rice" was a term originally used on all Japanese vehicles imported into the U.S. Therefore if you have a Japanese vehicle it is "rice" so how can you say that modifing a Japanese vehicle makes it look "rice"?

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Thank you for the etymology lesson. Despite what it originally meant, the term "ricer" is currently used to refer to any automotive mods that are kitsch (meaning that they tastelessly imitate something functional). Examples are:

• Fart can exhaust. Kitsch, cause it doesn't add any HP... it's just a big chrome tip meant to look like it's a high performance exhaust.
  
  
• Lambo doors. Kitsch, because they serve no purpose. Real lambo doors are designed to improve ingress/egress into an exotic sports car with special design needs.
  
  
• Huge wings on the rear of the car. Kitsch, because they usually add no downforce and most of the time just increase drag and add a lot of turbulence, in effect decreasing the car's aerodynamics.
  
  
• Most body kits. Often times, they are tasteless, but usually just meaningless, because they are not wind-tunnel tested and add no significant improvement to aerodynamics.
  
  
• Black-painted steel wheels (aka hubcap delete). Steel wheels are the heaviest you can find. Painting them black and losing the hubcaps doesn't improve your performance.
  
  
• Painted calipers. Meant to make stock calipers look like Brembos, or some other aftermarket variety, which often come in bright colors. Contrary to popular opinion, the paint does not improve the performance of the stock brakes.
  
  
• Cut springs. Cutting your springs may give your car a lower ride, but it will significantly hamper your vehicle's performance. Lowering the car with aftermarket springs may improve the ride, but unless you're going with a complete suspension redesign (or at least coilovers) you're likely going to just screw up the suspension geometry.
  
  
• Hood scoops. Usually just adds drag. Unless you've got a ram-air induction system going on, this is pathetic. Reference Mustang GT for factory-supplied kitsch.

On the other hand, you have "bling" - a term which refers to mods that are intended to be purely aesthetic, without imitating performance modifications. These include:

• Big chrome wheels,
• Spinners,
• Chrome grills,
• Lights in wheels, hood, neon under car, etc.,
• TVs in headrests,
• Custom paint,
• etc. etc.

So to recap:

Chrome wheels = bling.
Lambo doors = ricer.

I hope you understand what I'm getting at.

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Originally Posted by transio

Thank you for the etymology lesson. Despite what it originally meant, the term "ricer" is currently used to refer to any automotive mods that are kitsch (meaning that they tastelessly imitate something functional).

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I think the more common term used to generalize Japanese imports was "rice burner" . "Rice" and "ricer" evolved from that term to refer to tasteless, functionless modifications like cheap body kits and tin can tailpipes.

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Originally Posted by transio

[*]Black-painted steel wheels (aka hubcap delete). Steel wheels are the heaviest you can find. Painting them black and losing the hubcaps doesn't improve your performance.
[*]Painted calipers. Meant to make stock calipers look like Brembos, or some other aftermarket variety, which often come in bright colors. Contrary to popular opinion, the paint does not improve the performance of the stock brakes.

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I'd classify these as purely aesthetic, and therefore "bling" if done in a professional way that improves the look of the vehicle. I don't think anyone actually believes these mods will improve performance.

body kits and and painted calipers add looks to a car.. add uniqueness to a car... anyone (especially VX owners) can appreciate making your car unique... i think lambo doors have the same effect... making the car unique and if you are willing to sacrifice money, and maybe some of your ability to get out of the car for being unique then do it! who cares what other people think of your car if you like it

baldwin- theres almost no such thing as a 'bolt on' kit for any car, especially a VX, chances are if you do the lambo kit, youll end up having to do some kind of modding of some sort, so before you tell the shop to do it, you should see exactly what they are going to need to do and if it can be reversed, you wont know until you try though

Uh, the VX is EXTREMELY rigid. It was an SLK.

What would really do if Transio wasnt a member? Hum......Id be bored at work cause there would not be anyone intelligently stating their opinions, therefore, cuasing the threads to be less interesting.....

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Originally Posted by transio

...On the other hand, you have "bling" - a term which refers to mods that are intended to be purely aesthetic, without imitating performance modifications. These include:

• Big chrome wheels,
• Spinners,
• Chrome grills,
• Lights in wheels, hood, neon under car, etc.,
• TVs in headrests,
• Custom paint,
• etc. etc.

So to recap:

Chrome wheels = bling.
Lambo doors = ricer.

I hope you understand what I'm getting at.

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The way a car door opens has no effect on the cars performance and according to you they are only aesthetic, since you say they serve no functional purpose; therefore, vertical doors would be "bling" not "ricer" according to your definition.

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Originally Posted by kpaske

"Rice" and "ricer" evolved from that term to refer to tasteless, functionless modifications like cheap body kits and tin can tailpipes.

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Right. That's the derivation that I was using. :)

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Originally Posted by kpaske

I'd classify these as purely aesthetic, and therefore "bling" if done in a professional way that improves the look of the vehicle. I don't think anyone actually believes these mods will improve performance.

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Actually, the mods are intended to mimic other mods that actually DO improve performance, like upgraded brake calipers (often painted bright colors by the manufacturer to help market their products) and aftermarket race wheels (which are often powdercoated, anodized, or painted black to decrease maintenance for brake dust cleanup). The idea behind painted calipers and wheels is to get the "racy look" without actually improving performance. They are, therefore, "rice" to the core.

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Originally Posted by etlsport

body kits and and painted calipers add looks to a car.. add uniqueness to a car... anyone (especially VX owners) can appreciate making your car unique... i think lambo doors have the same effect... making the car unique

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Unique? You mean except for the 1000s of other ricers with lambo doors at all the kids' car meets, right? Even if I conceded to the unique argument, that is independent of the taste argument. In short, being unique isn't always a good thing. As evidence, I present:

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/atta...1&d=1156883449

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Originally Posted by JAFO

The way a car door opens has no effect on the cars performance and according to you they are only aesthetic, since you say they serve no functional purpose; therefore, vertical doors would be "bling" not "ricer" according to your definition.

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Actually, I said that vertical doors DO have a purpose for the cars that come with them. Read up on the Mercedes SL 300 Gullwing for a little more information on how and why vertical doors came to be. The function is to better enable ingress/egress in sports cars with high/wide sills. If your car doesn't have big sills (the VX doesn't) then vertical doors serve no purpose, and in fact, often INHIBIT ingress and egress, because the doors on "normal" cars aren't DESIGNED to be opened vertically. They don't have the proper shape or connection to the vehicle, and therefore wind up covering half of the opening, making it more difficult to get in and out. Note that this is the OPPOSITE of why vertical doors were invented!!! THAT is why they are "ricer" in my opinion - the same as huge wings bolted onto your trunk.

Some more info from Wikipedia:

• "The gullwing doors, hinged at the roof and so named because the open doors resembled a bird's outstretched wings, were implemented as such to accommodate for the car's tubular chassis, designed by DBAG's chief developing engineer, Rudolf Uhlenhaut. Part of the chassis passed through what would be the lower half of a standard door. This tubular chassis was a necessity, as the original car was designed solely for racing and needed to be as light as possible while still providing a high level of strength. This required the driver and any passengers to do some gymnastics to get in or out of the car, usually by sitting on and sliding across the wide door sill. A steering wheel with a tilt-away column made the process considerably easier."

Note the height of the sills in the pic below... this is to accomodate the spaceframe chassis, which is very rigid while also being very light.

http://www.stevenmoseley.com/vehicross/gulllwing.jpg

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Originally Posted by JHarris1385

What would really do if Transio wasnt a member? Hum......Id be bored at work cause there would not be anyone intelligently stating their opinions, therefore, cuasing the threads to be less interesting.....

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You flatter me. Thanks. :) There are many people on VX.info who intelligently state their opinions, though. If there were no one presenting a decent counterpoint, what would be the point of making an argument at all? ;)

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Originally Posted by JAFO

The Lotus Elise has high and wide sills but still uses standard outward swinging doors.

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Right. And if you had ever gotten in or out of one with the top on, you would understand the purpose of vertical doors. The Lotus Elise has a serious design flaw in poor ingress/egress. Of course, it was originally designed as an open-top roadster. With the hard top in place, though, getting in and out is seriously debilitating. So much so that there's an aftermarket company that started making gullwing hardtops to make it easier to get in and out.

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/atta...1&d=1149592568

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Unique? You mean except for the 1000s of other ricers with lambo doors at all the kids' car meets, right? Even if I conceded to the unique argument, that is independent of the taste argument. In short, being unique isn't always a good thing. As evidence, I present:

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/atta...1&d=1156883449

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well, ive never seen a VX with lambo doors so it would be unique... i guess it all comes to personal preference.. i dont think anyone here could honestly say that ferarri(?) doesnt make them want to puke.. but obviously someone likes it, i know lots of people who think my VX is hideous.. but it doesnt bother me, cause i love it

http://www.lsd-doors.de/content/50_D..._beifahrer.wmv

Great feedback guys. Thanks! Uhh...I'll do without the Hello Kitty hood insert though. :cool: I'm trying to see if one of the lambo door companies will find it unique to get the first VehiCROSS on their list which will be featured on the upcoming videos and marketing packages for the CD release and concert tour. Hopefully they can cut me a deal or something. I do get looks all the time with the near stock VX just pullin' up...but I can only imagine what people would say if I got out, and the doors went up! You KNOW i'll be bumpin' it too when I pull into the parking lot! Well, cross your fingers. If I can do well with the CD and land a major record deal, maybe one day I'll buy another VX and do EVERYTHING possible to it. It'll be the ultimate car for the hip hop enthusiest and you guys will all be invited to the Grammy after show party! You all just have to roll in with the VX's! :cool: Ok...I'm dreamin' now. But who knows? I'll keep prayin' though. :)

Good luck man, just don't let the dreams of glory blind you when the big labels come by and offer you stardom in exchange for your freedom, they usually reneg on the stardom bit but keep your freedom anyway.

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Originally Posted by transio

Right. And if you had ever gotten in or out of one with the top on, you would understand the purpose of vertical doors. The Lotus Elise has a serious design flaw in poor ingress/egress.

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So does the VX - it should have had two suicide doors for the rear passengers. If the Lambo or Gullwing doors address this flaw, then they become functional by your definition.

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Originally Posted by transio

Actually, the mods are intended to mimic other mods that actually DO improve performance, like upgraded brake calipers (often painted bright colors by the manufacturer to help market their products) and aftermarket race wheels (which are often powdercoated, anodized, or painted black to decrease maintenance for brake dust cleanup). The idea behind painted calipers and wheels is to get the "racy look" without actually improving performance. They are, therefore, "rice" to the core.

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Actually, since I know jack ***** about race cars, when I painted *my* calipers the intent was purely aesthetic - I think the blue paint helps to draw attention to the wheels and rotors and the contrasting colors just look nice. It *IS* purely aesthetic and was never intended to "mimic" anything. However, for the most part I agree with you. Most true "ricers" likely do it to make a regular 4 banger look like a tuner car.

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Originally Posted by kpaske

So does the VX - it should have had two suicide doors for the rear passengers. If the Lambo or Gullwing doors address this flaw, then they become functional by your definition.

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I'll concede to that. But you'd have to cut into the B-pillars to do that, which would compromise the structural integrity of the vehicle unless you do some serious reengineering.

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Originally Posted by kpaske

when I painted *my* calipers the intent was purely aesthetic - I think the blue paint helps to draw attention to the wheels and rotors and the contrasting colors just look nice... Most true "ricers" likely do it to make a regular 4 banger look like a tuner car.

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Right, well most aftermarket brake kits are red or yellow, anyway, so I'd probably put blue calipers on the "bling" list. My Elise had red painted calipers and engine cover. I thought it was a little "ricer" looking, but they were high performance calipers straight from the factory, so I kinda shrugged it off. I probably wouldn't have done it myself, though. If anything, I might have painted them yellow to match the car.

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Originally Posted by transio

My Elise had red painted calipers and engine cover. I thought it was a little "ricer" looking, but they were high performance calipers straight from the factory, so I kinda shrugged it off.

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I can't believe you'd ever think "ricer" and "Elise" in the same thought. Shame on you. I think it's usually obvious when mods are done to make an automobile look like something it's not, so the term is somewhat subjective for me. IMO even red calipers look great on a VX because it gives it more of a "customized" look. On a 1992 lowered Yugo with a body kit? That's just plain stupid.

who's gonna try it?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Isuzu-Vehicross-Heavy-Duty-90-Vertical-Lambo-Door-Kit_W0QQitemZ150083043239QQihZ005QQcategoryZ88433Q QrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem



This was one of the best threads I've read on here, by the way.

We need to find someone in the sacramento, CA area to do this so they can make a deal with the Hyundai/Isuzu wrecking yard there to do a preliminary install(like 1 side only) on one of their crashed VX's. If that thing ended up not working/fitting/or leaking, and I just hacked up my own VX to see, I would be pretty pissed indeed. Why not buy the kit, then try it out on something that is not going to be hurt by it?

Tell me more about this Isuzu wrecking yard in Sac? I would like to know because I would like to vulture some parts from another Black VX...

Bart

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Originally Posted by Ascinder

We need to find someone in the sacramento, CA area to do this so they can make a deal with the Hyundai/Isuzu wrecking yard there to do a preliminary install(like 1 side only) on one of their crashed VX's. If that thing ended up not working/fitting/or leaking, and I just hacked up my own VX to see, I would be pretty pissed indeed. Why not buy the kit, then try it out on something that is not going to be hurt by it?

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Oh man, Bart, you're killing me right? The link is right on this site under web links on the main page. It's the allhyundaiisuzuparts.com. wrecking yard. It's in Rancho Cordova(Sacramento). You my friend are also in luck, since I just happen to be going there this weekend. If you or CrnCnn need anything, I can at least save you a trip or shipping. If you follow the link, I think they have one that has been "parted out" and one fresh one. I'm not sure what's still available, but I'm going down for an intake manifold myself, and maybe some headlight enclosures. If you PM a phone number and maybe a desired parts list, I can send you pictures from my camera phone to see if you want the parts or not.

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Originally Posted by nfpgasmask

Tell me more about this Isuzu wrecking yard in Sac? I would like to know because I would like to vulture some parts from another Black VX...

Bart

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I also know of a salvaged black VX out of state that has a BUNCH of parts left from it.
PM if interested so as not to COMPLETELY hijack this thread.