Head bolts?! How freakin tight?!

I was trying to break my stock motor down as FAR as possible so I could lug it around and get rid of it... well, I had to go buy a 10mm allen wrench socket... tried a break-over bar... NO WAY... I went ahead and TRIED my impact wrench... OMG! How freakin tight are these things?! Geesh! The dang impact wouldn't even budge them! Perhaps I need to resort to something bigger... BUT WHAT?! Anyone ever have one of these motors apart?

BTW, leaving at 9am tomorrow for sure this time... going to Pontiac Illinoise to pick up my LS1 and 4L60E trans... gonna end up spending around 13-14 hours on the road tomorrow... talk about a LONG drive and a LONG day!

I'll report back once I get the motor in hand... or back home anyway.

TTYL!

> Illinoise

LoL!

Forgot the ' and the space
"Ill'in noise"

OK ok ok... so I can't spell... I used to travel for FIVE years in Illinois for work... and I STILL can't spell the damn thing right! SOOOOORRRRY! LMAO! Now, back to the REAL subject... what are the heads torqued to?! Geesh! Just curious.

Randy

Those are probably socket head cap screws. My DSM had them stock, also 10mm. Stripped the teeth on my flex head ratchet. 2ft snap-on breaker bar and really had to lean on it. I'd say I put at least 200ftlbs into getting them out.

With an aluminum head I'd be suprised to see the torque spec be more than 80-90ftlbs, but if the ends of those bolts go into the water jacket there may be some rust holding them in too.

John C.

Well, I didn't figure they'd be that tight either... but maybe there is some truth to the rust statement. I couldn't believe they are that tight... I had something close to 2 ft of break-over on mine too... but I can't lean too hard... the motor is balanced on its oil pan and motor mount stuffed under the front if it to keep it level. If I lean too hard, I get to find out JUST how light/heavy the motor is at this point. Don't care to go there. I want it torn down so I can move it around easier. I'm running out of space in the garage... with all the junk I have, the project VW Super Beetle and ALLL the VX guys laying around. Anyway... good to see someone get past my "Illinoise" statement.

TTYL!

Coach

the torque is only 47 lbft. you need a good supply of air and a good impact wrench. shawn

Well, the torque in this case is obviously more than 47lbft.

-Daver

Quote:

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Originally posted by psychos2
the torque is only 47 lbft. you need a good supply of air and a good impact wrench. shawn

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Well, what do you torque your lug nuts to when you put your wheels on? 90lbs? Somewhere around that... give or take? Well, its been quite awhile since I last did my own rotate but I would always torque them with a torque wrench... I however have NEVER had a problem getting them back off with my impact... my compressor at full is around 90psi and my impact will do WAY more than 47lbs. Soooo... WHY can't I get these off? Geesh! I don't guess it matters a ton but I wanted to look into the guys of my motor.

Any other suggestions? Lemme know.

TTYL!

Coach

Wheels are supposed to be 87 ftlbs, yes.

87 ftlbs is no big deal with a 2ft bar.

John's 200 ftlbs estimate sounds a lot more realistic considering the trouble you're having.

-Daver

Daver , the original torque is only 47 lbft. when there is rust and corrosion it takes more force to remove the bolts.sometimes at work we have to use a 1/2 impact instead of a 3/8 to remove head bolts. try a bigger impact wrench or more air pressure. shawn

How about losing the balancing act and just lean the engine on one side and loosen the bolts on the side that's up, then lean it the other way for the opposite side. You might be able to foot the block and get more torque on it.

Quote:

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Originally posted by psychos2
...use a 1/2 impact instead of a 3/8 to remove head bolts. try a bigger impact wrench or more air pressure...

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Already using a 1/2" impact! And heck, I have been able to removed the spindle nuts on my '78 VW Super Beetle that are torqued to some rediculous +300lbs... heck, its been so long, I might be thinking low... it could be MORE! lol Don't recall for sure... anyway...

As for losing the balancing act... I have no idea how much I have sitting here... basic long block minus intake and exhaust manifold... still gotta weigh a few lbs... I still think an impact should work!

Well... back to the drawing board. TTYL!

Coach!

I had to remove steel plugs from an aluminum head on my '92 Dodge I.R.O.C. RT Daytona and it was a real ballbuster. I think that partly it was the different metals sharing different expansion rates and a corrosion between them.
I also gave up trying to get a long steel bolt out of an aluminum alternator on my Fiero. Wound up using a carbide cutter to wack off the bolt head and nut and removing alternator. Once off..it was as though the steel bolt and aluminum alternator chemically welded themselves together!
I used "never-seize" compound on the new bolt and replacement alternator on the Fiero hoping it'll come apart if need be the next time!

Well, I carefully layed the motor on its side and then tried to use the breakover bar... I guess I had cracked the socket already because I split the dang thing WIDE open... guess I need to find a 10mm IMPACT socket next time... I really wish the Snap-on guy would come while I was actually at work! Damn the luck!

Ahh well... again.. BACK to the drawing board. This thing may leave my hands in fewer pieces that I wanted it to. DAMN!

Randy!

You do know about the lefty-loosy, righty-tighty thing, don't ya??


:D


Just kidding.


I'd be inclined to go along with the dissimilar metal idea, in that there may be more holding the two together than just torque. A friend of mine had the same trouble with a motor he was disassembling. At one point, the head broke off the bolt. We just welded it back on and kept trying. Applying some heat eventually helped.

Im no help withthe VX bolts but for your super bug spindle, invest in a VW spindle nut tool..its about $10, sometimes you can find them on ebay. Also works for 4 lug 76-82 porsche 924's(might make it easier to find) .. its heavy (steel?) and it goes over the nut and has a lip you whack with a hammer. 5lb sledge and that tool and itll pop that puppy right off..;Dy;

are you using an extension?an extension absorbs the impact . the fact that it was not an impact socket could also be a problem. shawn

Like he said above, give it some heat. Galvanic action could indeed be involved, in addition to whatever corrosion might come from exposure of the bolt body to coolant. Another option is if you have a long heavy centerpunch to hold on the bolt head and smack with a 2-1/2 lb. or heavier mallet, possibly setting up a vibration to loosen the bolt. I know the Japaneese used to be notorious for using impact drivers for assembling their cycles.

...Old school leverage trick. You have a 2 foot breaker, add more leverage by using a piece of iron pipe over the handle of the breaker bar. Should help :yes:

I had a friend of mine over this evening... checking out the progress... well, he helped hold the motor while I put about three feet of break-over bar to the headbolts... DAMN! Got them busted loose... actually BROKE two of the headbolts... must be that corrosion inside the motor... all I can guess. Got that head off... had to come in and start getting cleaned up for bed... I'll pop the other off tomorrow... now that I KNOW I need a helping hand I'll be fine. TTYL!

Coach!