Considering a VX ...

Hello all,

I suppose I should start with, I do not own a VX. I didn't even know such a think existed until about 3 weeks ago. I seen a yellow one parked at a pump in Colorado Springs, CO. Curious I drove over to check it out. All I could see (it was dark) was that it was an Isuzu of some kind. I really liked it and to be honest, I didn't think much about it. Then a couple days ago there was a Reddit post about one. I knew it was the same vehicle, so scanning the comments I found the name Vehicross. I had something to google, and I have been, a lot. I'm not sure why, but I find I cannot get enough information about this vehicle, I think it is becoming a bot of an obsession.

I should also mention that my daily driver is a 2013 Tacoma 4WD, which I love. However, a few friends and I have decided to try our hand at "Overlanding". We are currently planning a very long trip to Alaska (June-2016) then follow the Pan-American to at least the Mexico border for our first major trip. The eventual goal is to complete the entire highway within 10 years.

I had been assuming that I would use my Tacoma for the trip. After seeing the VX for the time, I am no longer sure about that. There is still a lot to learn about this vehicle, and I may not even end up buying one. What this does offer over the Tacoma (at least initially) is a lower cost platform to start with, leaving more room in the budget for other things. The VX is currently the strongest competitor for using on the trip besides the Tacoma. As with any such adventure, money will be the key factor, but there are others (off-road capabilities, storage space, reliability, etc...)

Anyway, I wanted to introduce myself and it didn't feel right to do so in the normal thread as I do not (or may not) own a VX. I will probably have a lot of questions though. I look forward to learning as much as I can.

Good timing!...check this thread from today as well :thumbup:


http://www.vehicross.info/forums/sho...threadid=26406

The "BIG" questionnaire that Vendetta linked to in the above thread is a great check list.

If you are concerned at all about MPG for this big trip...

....the VX isnt great, 18-20 ish MPG stock depending on your right foot!


Jo

Here's one read for you:

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/sho...light=overland

& a mo betta one:

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/sho...light=overland

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Originally Posted by JoFotoz

....the VX isnt great, 18-20 ish MPG stock depending on your right foot!


Jo

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I remember remembering those days...

Stock is for guns and soup.
-V

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Originally Posted by Vendetta

Stock is for soup.
-V

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Hence your assless chaps???

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Originally Posted by JoFotoz

....the VX isnt great, 18-20 ish MPG stock depending on your right foot!

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I know that Isuzu makes a fairly reliable turbo diesel that is nearly all mechanical. I am thinking if I get one with a bad engine I could just do a swap, though I haven't yet figured out if that will affect the TOD system. The (limited) info I was able to find on it suggests it should bolt directly to the transmission, but it doesn't really talk about any other issues, such as electrical connections.

the vx is a vary capable vehicle. they are reliable as long as you take the oil consumption issue. not hard, its an easy fix. my vx does not use up oil. i use BG 109 and BG MOA also use mobile one full synthetic. and i also do a BG induction clean two times a year. however you have to get creative with storage. if you are planning on lifting the vx you could use the rear tire area for storage. if you ever want to check out mine im in Denver.

6232 beach st unit c6
denver co 80221
7202553841

this is my shop

Welcome to the club! Just down South a bit from me.

Let me just say, I wouldn't consider the VX a strong candidate for overlanding. The VX is super tough, off-road capable and reliable BUT lacks one thing, SPACE. While the 91" wheel base makes the VX nimble off road and the sloped sides add a unique look, they both cut into the cargo capacity that's essential for long overlanding trips. Sure, you can get around this by building a rugged trailer or adding a big basket to the top but it can't compare to a pickup.

That's why I wouldn't pick a VX as a strong outlander... however I would choose a VX over a Tacoma (and most other vehicles) any day of the week. I owned a newer Tundra and the VX before I bought a house. I had to downsize to save some extra money and chose to sell my amazing, comfortable, and practical Tundra instead of the VX. I miss that Tundra but would make the same choice 100% of the time. Nothing beats the cool factor of driving a VX even if there is some obvious trade-offs. So, you might decide it’s worth getting a VX just to own one and still use the Tacoma for the overlanding trip. :thumbup:

Good luck with the research and decision. :_steering

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Originally Posted by tom4bren

Hence your assless chaps???

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Hey don't be hatin' on the culinary skilz! Everyone knows that men make better chefs. ;)

Byeeee! (LOL)
-V

Tacoma = overall better overland experience. VX = better pics. Choose wisely.

-V

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Originally Posted by 8695Beaters

Anyway, my question is: what are the trouble spots I should look out for?

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Originally Posted by Otwobme

they are reliable as long as you take the oil consumption issue. not hard, its an easy fix

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^^^This is EXACTLY what I meant when I was asking about "are there any trouble spots I should look out for?" Losing oil would be a concern! What is the oil consumption issue and what is the fix?

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Originally Posted by 8695Beaters

^^^This is EXACTLY what I meant when I was asking about "are there any trouble spots I should look out for?" Losing oil would be a concern! What is the oil consumption issue and what is the fix?

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Many of them use up oil. Some do not. The solution is check oil when you fill up and top it off if it low.

The oil consumption issue, as others have said, is hit or miss. Some VX's burn a LOT others don't burn any. My VX used to burn 3/4 or a quart of oil every +/-350 miles. I say "used to" because I had to replace my engine at about 130k miles, but not because it starved itself of oil. Like just about everyone here I would check my oil at EVERY gas fill up and top it off as needed. I ended up burning a couple of valves in cylinder three of my old engine which is why I had to replace it.

The leading theory on the oil consumption is that in the original 3.5L engines Isuzu did not drill enough/ large enough oil drain back holes in the pistons so the oil couldn't get back into the engine on the piston down stroke and would just get burned up during the combustion stroke. Crazy thing is that, to my knowledge, none of us see the tell tale blue smoke of an oil burning engine (or get the burned oil smell for that matter).

The fix for all of this, IF your VX is burning oil, is to either replace the engine with a new 3.5L engine which has bigger/more oil drain back holes drilled in the pistons, tear down your existing (or a used) 3.5L engine and drill the holes in the pistons yourself, install a 3.2L engine (used or otherwise), or do a complete engine swap for something else (diesel, V8, etc.).

From what I have found online, most of the vehicles that are still running have a LOT of miles. So an engine rebuild/replace would probably have been added to the cost of buying one anyway (if not right away, soon after purchase). So really it depends on budget. Since I won't need to drive it right away, I can start in the motor/drivetrain from the beginning.

For long overlanding treks my concern would be parts availability. Some parts are getting very hard to find for the VX. Pretty much every parts store anywhere on this continent carry parts for a Tacoma.

like i said, the oil issue can be corrected by BG OIL CHANGE. parts are available by using trooper parts. the only issue i see is space. i would take mine over-landing in a hart beat. you just have to plan smart/ahead just like you would do anyways...

How much space (or weight?) would be gained by removing the back seats?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 8695Beaters

^^^This is EXACTLY what I meant when I was asking about "are there any trouble spots I should look out for?" Losing oil would be a concern! What is the oil consumption issue and what is the fix?

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The oil consumption question is specifically on that first questionnaire....:_thinking

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Originally Posted by Otwobme

like i said, the oil issue can be corrected by BG OIL CHANGE. parts are available by using trooper parts. the only issue i see is space. i would take mine over-landing in a hart beat. you just have to plan smart/ahead just like you would do anyways...

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Not all parts can be swapped for Trooper parts, and the biggest concern is pertaining to BODY PANELS.

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Originally Posted by Thelgord

How much space (or weight?) would be gained by removing the back seats?

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Back seat weighs about 65 lbs, but it does add a ton of space. I removed mine within the first month. Got a long rubber cargo mat to fill the back space, made it very useful.

Contact member "Ala5ka". He specifically outfitted his for overlanding and so far has made the trek from Alaska down to San Diego. He resides part time in Wikenburg, AZ, and partly in AK. Suspect he's probably in AZ at this time of year, but not sure.


He did several detailed posts about it:
http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=23967

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=25495

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Originally Posted by VX KAT

The oil consumption question is specifically on that first questionnaire....:_thinking

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Checking the dipstick is standard operating procedure for shopping for any used car. "Check the oil level" is different from "these engines have a tendency to consume oil at a frequent pace." I did drive the VX I posted about and had a few more questions about it which can be found here: http://vehicross.info/forums/showthr...820#post302820

To the OP, as someone who popped their VX cherry last night, BUY IT!!! It was a ton of fun.

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Originally Posted by VX KAT

...
Not all parts can be swapped for Trooper parts, and the biggest concern is pertaining to BODY PANELS.
...
He did several detailed posts about it:

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Repairing body panels may be an issue.

Thanks for the links. Good read. I really like the "oil catch can" solution to the valve issue.

If you want to get a closer look give me a shout. I'm just up 25 in Castle Rock and work from home most of the time so usually around.

I appreciate that. Thank you. Unfortunately booked this weekend with work and fixing a welder. If I get time I may hit you up. The people here are very eager to show off there VX. Haven't seen that much on other forums. Sorry for the short replies, I'm on my phone :/

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Originally Posted by 8695Beaters

Checking the dipstick is standard operating procedure for shopping for any used car. "Check the oil level" is different from "these engines have a tendency to consume oil at a frequent pace."

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From original questionnaire:
~Any oil consumption noted, under ANY conditions? (some seem to consume a little when on prolonged highway driving)

From expanded detailed questionnaire:
~Any oil consumption noted, under ANY conditions?.....dripping, blowing smoke from exhaust or just consuming it
(some seem to consume a little when on prolonged highway driving)



:_thinking ...huh...funny, I don't see "check the dipstick" or "check the oil level" in either of these....second one is even in BOLD letters.


:_shrug: You're welcome! Sorry for trying to help you. :_shrug:
I tried to guide you to the specific issues, but apparently you don't understand.

No more help from me....
Too bad too, cuz I have a huge database of VX info all categorized and organized....

-VX KAT out....:rollo:


.

It's probably nothing personal, Kat. Newcomers to the platform just don't yet know what they don't know. So while checking oil is of course an obvious thing to do when buying a car - it's a-whole-nother thing when buying a VX which has been saddled with an engine accused of inadequate design to begin with.

So stay helpy - you never know who's gonna read your tips downstream. :)

And 'Beaters, don't bite the hand that feeds, dude. Bad form 'specially for VX greenhorn. We're a good bunch and don't really do the measuring dicks thing here. Stay cool.

-V

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Originally Posted by Vendetta

So stay helpy - you never know who's gonna read your tips downstream. :)

-V

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But of course V ;)

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Originally Posted by Thelgord

How much space (or weight?) would be gained by removing the back seats?

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The space/weight savings is so minimal, that it wouldn't be worth removing the rear seat if you ever plan on having more than just one other person ride in the vehicross with you.

I made the mistake of selling my back seat, now I want to buy one because I have a daughter that I would like have ride with me, along with my wife and dog. I was thinking about fabricating a seat or two, but really there's so little space behind the front seats that having the OEM bench seat is the best way to go.

I think you may have misunderstood my intent. If I should purchase a VX it will be for building a dedicated Overland rig. This will not be a daily driver, nor will it be a parking lot queen. This vehicle will probably be doing things it was never intended to do all of the sake of adventure, a few pictures and a whole lot of memories.

I am still running the numbers and collecting data vs my Tacoma. It is surprisingly close when everything is tabulated. One of the things I am considering is dumping the TOD system and just going with a manual transfer case and manual hubs with a set of lockers. With the electrical issues of the VX I think this may be a "safe" move. Another option is a diesel conversion for extended range (cost less than many people would think). For either vehicle I will be making my own trail armor so that is not really a factor. What really brings the numbers close though, is the VX won't have a $450/month payment and it will cost less to insure.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Otwobme

the vx is a vary capable vehicle. they are reliable as long as you take the oil consumption issue. not hard, its an easy fix. my vx does not use up oil. i use BG 109 and BG MOA also use mobile one full synthetic. and i also do a BG induction clean two times a year.

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So I did a search in the forums for the BG Oil Change, and haven't found any process for it.. can you point me toward a writeup on this? Or.. maybe you can make one, pretty please ;)? I'd like no oil consumption too, but I don't know what all to get or what exactly to do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Thelgord

I think you may have misunderstood my intent. If I should purchase a VX it will be for building a dedicated Overland rig. This will not be a daily driver, nor will it be a parking lot queen. This vehicle will probably be doing things it was never intended to do all of the sake of adventure, a few pictures and a whole lot of memories.

I am still running the numbers and collecting data vs my Tacoma. It is surprisingly close when everything is tabulated. One of the things I am considering is dumping the TOD system and just going with a manual transfer case and manual hubs with a set of lockers. With the electrical issues of the VX I think this may be a "safe" move. Another option is a diesel conversion for extended range (cost less than many people would think). For either vehicle I will be making my own trail armor so that is not really a factor. What really brings the numbers close though, is the VX won't have a $450/month payment and it will cost less to insure.

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Like I said, "Ala5ka" (Chase) may be a good person to talk with since he's doing the overlanding thang.

:confused:

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Originally Posted by MSHardeman

The oil consumption issue...the original 3.5L engines Isuzu did not drill enough/ large enough oil drain back holes in the pistons ...The fix for all of this, IF your VX is burning oil, is to either replace the engine with a new 3.5L engine...

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What did your engine replacement cost? I would have to take this to a shop to do the work as I am not mechanically inclined to work on my own vehicles, nor do I have the time. Would you recommend an Isuzu dealer or a more generic shop? Are 3.5L engines (new) easy to find?

I can't exactly remember, but I think the new engine was around $5700. I took my VX to a local shop that I trusted to do the engine swap (not a dealer, Isuzu or otherwise) and they charged me $1,500ish to put the new engine in. Here is the thread where I delivered the sad news about needing a new engine: http://www.vehicross.info/forums/sho...t=22812&page=5

Isuzu has pulled out of the consumer car market in the US so there really aren't any Isuzu dealers left, just dealers that used to sell and service Isuzu's.

As for finding a new 3.5L; that is getting harder and harder to do. When I bought mine I was told that there were only 16 new 3.5L crate motors in the US so I have a feeling that number is way down now if not already at zero.

A few others here have either had their engines rebuilt, installed used engines, or installed refurbished engines and I think most of them haven't had a problem.

Hope that helps some.

I'd probably got his route if I was going to replace the engine:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Isuzu-98-02-TROOPER-V6-99-01-VehiCROSS-02-03AXIOM-6VE1-Engine-Long-Block-ILB6VE1-/130954960189?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories &fits=Year%3A2001|Make%3AIsuzu|Model%3AVehiCROSS|S ubmodel%3ABase|Engine+-+Liter_Display%3A3.5L&hash=item1e7d861d3d&vxp=mtr

Or something similar with a warranty.