Preping for off-road

Hey all - I'm really enjoying my VX and have done a couple of off-road adventures. I'm hoping to make it to Moab so I'm starting some preperations now and I've got a couple of questions. This thread is probably going to go all over the place but I'll try to keep it centered. Please bear in mind, that because my VX is so rare I don't want to do anything to it cosmetic or structural to negatively affect the value. However, to me, it would be a tragedy to lock her up in the garage and never take her out where she was created to be. So here are the questions...

1) There's a 99 Trooper near me that is being parted. Keeping in mind that I don't want to change anything from the stock VX, what parts do they share that you recommend I get for spares? (i.e. halfshafts, switches, etc.).

2) Are the stock wheels from the trooper the same size & offset as the early VX's? Mine is a 2001 but I want to run smaller wheels (15") so I can put larger rubber on them and use them for off-roading so I don't tear up my stock wheels. I've read that the ideal would be 15x7's with a 29" tire?

3) Armour - I've already built a custom skid plate for the diff and I'm either going to build sliders or buy some. Other than that, is there any other armour that is critical for off-roading (no significant rock climbing)? It looks like nobody sells skid plate kits for our VX's anymore.

4) I've heard rumours of people using their handbrake as an "offset" brake to tension the left rear wheel when they have LSD. The result is that it supposedly acts like a rear locker? Anybody else know anything about this and if so, can this be done on the VX?

5) I already own a lot of standard off-roading accessories (CB, Straps, Slings, Shackles). Is there anything else that could be unique to the VX that I need to put in the kit?

Thanks for all your input. I've attached a couple of pics from this last weekends activities in Hungry Valley. I was the only VX in a sea of Jeeps (17) and 4Runners (2). These are the typical trails that are in my area. (If any of you SoCal people ever want to try this just let me know. There's lots of good trails just north of LA).

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Originally Posted by ahdoman

Hey all - I'm really enjoying my VX and have done a couple of off-road adventures. I'm hoping to make it to Moab so I'm starting some preperations now and I've got a couple of questions. This thread is probably going to go all over the place but I'll try to keep it centered. Please bear in mind, that because my VX is so rare I don't want to do anything to it cosmetic or structural to negatively affect the value. However, to me, it would be a tragedy to lock her up in the garage and never take her out where she was created to be. So here are the questions...

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While quite rare the VX has yet to under go a financial bump to realize financial gains

[/QUOTE]1) There's a 99 Trooper near me that is being parted. Keeping in mind that I don't want to change anything from the stock VX, what parts do they share that you recommend I get for spares? (i.e. halfshafts, switches, etc.).[/QUOTE]
The parts that are interchangable are still plentiful and as such are pretty economically priced. It is the VX specific that are hard to get.

[/QUOTE]2) Are the stock wheels from the trooper the same size & offset as the early VX's? Mine is a 2001 but I want to run smaller wheels (15") so I can put larger rubber on them and use them for off-roading so I don't tear up my stock wheels. I've read that the ideal would be 15x7's with a 29" tire?[/QUOTE]
The 1999 VX wheels were 16's You can run sufficient meat on the stock wheels (up to 33s without trimming.

IIRC, if you run 15" rims, you'll have to make sure that you have enough offset to clear suspension or brake calipers (can't remember which).

I'm running 15" rims but have a lot of offset which causes it's own problem with interference. I get rubbing at full lock when the outboard edge of tire contacts the inside of the fender well.

The VX is pretty capable stock. I don't think that I'd mess with the e-brake to make the LSD in the rear work better. It already does a pretty good job. Some have installed a locker up front tho to add traction.

Circ...33's will require trimming and bfh work to fit. 31 is about as big as you can go with no (or little depending on tire) trimming.

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Originally Posted by Triathlete

Circ...33's will require trimming and bfh work to fit. 31 is about as big as you can go with no (or little depending on tire) trimming.

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I thought 33's for no trim and 35's with trim. But I do not run this large and was going from memory. I was also assuming a little torqing of the bars.

It already sounds like you're well on your way to making Pearl off-road worthy and I hope that you can make it to Moab this year because it would be great to meet both you and Pearl.

1) I'm not 100% sure what is compatible with the Trooper so hopefully others who have more experience with this will chime in. I do think that the front half shafts are compatible with the VX so I would grab those for sure. It sounds like, from another thread, the ABS module is compatible and many of ours have gone out (turning on the ABS light on the dash) so maybe grab that. I THINK the transmission and transfer case may be compatible with the VX and the engine may be compatible too. If the Trooper is a 3.2L the engine will drop right into the VX, but will have less power then the 3.5L.

2) I think that the stock Trooper rims will fit on a VX. I think some here have used Trooper rims on their VX.

3) The skid plates from a Trooper will fit on the VX. There is one that covers the transmission, one that covers the transfer case and a third that I can't remember what it covers. There are/where a couple of companies that made sliders for the VX, but I think one of them stopped making them. Hopefully someone with sliders will chime in.

4) You can definitely use your hand brake to "lock up" the rear diff when wheeling. Just pull up a couple of clicks on the hand brake lever and it does wonders. I use this trick at least one each year in Moab.

5) There really isn't anything unique that you'll need for the VX. Unless you have sliders you won't be able to use a high lift jack because we don't have any lift points on the VX.

Hope to meet you in May.

Given yours is the fabled Pear White Unicorn..... :)

I can see your reluctance to do any mods, that cant be undone.

I'd suggest Bolt on rock rails... its the least invasive for that issue.
31's and some very minor front edge cladding trim ....
(If they ever achieve true collector prices, you can retrofit an un cut front cladding)
OME after market rear springs..keep originals.... and t/bar crank.
And as mentioned..the Trooper skid plates /3 pieces bolt on/off.

I am also a HUGE fan of the dylan/Curt tow hitch as a GREAT rear skid plate..
...it offers awesome rear protection, and it bolts on/off .

And..as mentioned re the LSD.. no mods required...
....just the appropriate application of e-brake when needed.

Cheers
Jo

A lot also depends on the trails you plan to run. If you stick to easier trails a stock vx is just fine. Maybe some a/t tires for better grip ( Jack aka PBKid ran bald street tires his first year out).
If you want to experience the harder trails you can always find an open seat.

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Originally Posted by Triathlete

A lot also depends on the trails you plan to run. If you stick to easier trails a stock vx is just fine. Maybe some a/t tires for better grip ( Jack aka PBKid ran bald street tires his first year out).
If you want to experience the harder trails you can always find an open seat.

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As a stock height VXer (WITH 285/60-18s that raised the VX a little) that's done Moab 5 times in my VX, I've seen the "easier" trails significantly decline in condition and definitely went UP in difficulty level. Many others completely agreed. (Top of the World comes to mind!!!)

I have to say some skid plates (like the trooper ones) are a VERY VERY important idea. I scrapped the living crap out of my undercarriage and thank gawd for my full Kilby skids.....and even with that I managed to scrap a little area unprotected, and also completely mangled my lower control arm....and I'm NOT THAT BAD of an off road driver....so I'd recommend some protection...especially for Pearl!


I plan on coming in '15, can't wait to "meet" Pearl! :thumbup:

Sue, when I refer to easy I'm talking slightly harder than a dirt road...just way more scenic...Such as Hurrah Pass.

Hey everybody - thanks for the responses. So, armed with the new info I have a couple of follow up questions;

1) Compatible Trooper parts I'll try and get; half shafts, ABS module, wheels and skid plates. He also has a newly rebuilt engine with only 20k miles on it. Thankfully I don't need an engine but if someone else does let me know.

2) I think the Trooper wheels are 16" so if I can get those in the deal I'll look at putting some 31's on them. Does anybody know if they are the same offset as ours?

3) I was looking at the Rocky Road sliders unless I make my own. I prefer to have them bolt on. I really don't want to weld to the frame if I can help it and according to Rocky Road theirs bolt on. (Like your idea on the hitch Joe but I'm going to fabricate my own hidden hitch style).

4) It looks like the opinion is split on the hand brake. I want to confirm the concept though. My understanding is that the rear left wheel is the drive and the rear right is the slip? In other words, if all four wheels are stuck in the mud then the left rear will spin and the front right one? Then, if the left rear experiences "resistance" the diff engages the right rear? I know that's a bit simplified and obviously depends upon good clutch packs and components.

I really hope I can make it to Moab. Another friend (with an 2013 Landcruiser) and I would convoy out together and probably camp. But, I need to wait until we get closer so I can arrange for the time off. As much as I am looking forward to roading in Moab I am even more excited about meeting all of you.

The hand brake "locker" works.
Be aware that the trooper shafts have a slightly smaller ball in the cv than our vx. Will they work...yes. But it is not an exact fit and may cause some abnormal wear on the race in the green cup. A good option to carry as a spare (you only need one since they are interchangeable side to side) is maybe one of the surtrac shafts. They are relatively inexpensive.

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Originally Posted by Triathlete

Sue, when I refer to easy I'm talking slightly harder than a dirt road...just way more scenic...Such as Hurrah Pass.

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hmmmm Billy, then how come the "easy" trail (formerly known as VX only on Tuesday) was never that easy? You spotted me great on the end of Hell's Revenge that first year I went, and that was a frikkin' mini boulder mine field. I never heard anybody suggest Hurrah Pass. But LaSal mountain was truly "easy" and a gorgeous view, it's a great starter trail.

This was Top of the World....previously "easy"...now difficult for undercarriages!

http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/...2/DSCN1159.jpg

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Originally Posted by ahdoman

3) I was looking at the Rocky Road sliders unless I make my own. I prefer to have them bolt on. I really don't want to weld to the frame if I can help it and according to Rocky Road theirs bolt on. (Like your idea on the hitch Joe but I'm going to fabricate my own hidden hitch style).

I forgot to mention....I ALSO had the Rocky Road Super sliders....bolt on, and really gave good protection. Can see they really got chewed up! Highly recommend them!
http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/...S/DSCN2622.jpg

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...DER_DAMAGE.jpg

4) It looks like the opinion is split on the hand brake. I want to confirm the concept though. My understanding is that the rear left wheel is the drive and the rear right is the slip? In other words, if all four wheels are stuck in the mud then the left rear will spin and the front right one? Then, if the left rear experiences "resistance" the diff engages the right rear? I know that's a bit simplified and obviously depends upon good clutch packs and components.

It works, and it works fantastic! Doesn't really matter how it works....and whether it's left or right...if spinning a rear wheel, grab the e-brake and work it gently, one or two clicks usually does it.

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A few good examples where the e-brake worked great....first spinning tire in soft sand...then e-brake and up I went!

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...0/DSCN1886.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...0/DSCN1887.JPG

Got high centered here, stock height, before bigger tires. Luckily Moncha (in the hat) came over and told me how to use the e-brake here...we leaned to the left and e-braked a few clicks and it worked.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...venge003_3.jpg


Hell's Revenge "boulder mine field"...this was also when I was stock, before slightly larger tires. Had to carefully tip toe through this, WITH THE HELP OF A GREAT SPOTTER! Thanks Billy! (in the light blue shirt)
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...5/DSC_0345.jpg

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...0339_2_2_2.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...5/DSC_0334.jpg



AND COME ON, YOU GOTTA WANT TO DO THIS! . YOU'VE GOT TO COME TO MOAB!! IT'S AWESOME! :thumbup:
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/da...5/DSCN1665.JPG

Pix Kat

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Originally Posted by circmand

Pix Kat

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:laugho: yeah, since I don't have a VX anymore, maybe I should change my screen name to that! :slap:

Sue, the vx run was never considered or meant to be an "easy" run. It was meant to be easy enough not to damage a stock vx, but challenging enough to give those new to off reading a good sense of what the vx is capable of.
That said, most people want some level of challenge...Hurrah Pass is basically a scenic dirt road. Great for sight seeing but very little challenge.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vsz3II8J4V0

And of course it all comes down to perseption. What is easy to one may be difficult to another :D

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Originally Posted by VX KAT

:laugho: yeah, since I don't have a VX anymore, maybe I should change my screen name to that! :slap:

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get another VX. They are getting really cheap now

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Originally Posted by ahdoman

Hey everybody - thanks for the responses. So, armed with the new info I have a couple of follow up questions;

1) Compatible Trooper parts I'll try and get; half shafts, ABS module, wheels and skid plates. He also has a newly rebuilt engine with only 20k miles on it. Thankfully I don't need an engine but if someone else does let me know.

Trooper half-shafts will technically fit a VX but have a smaller CV race than the VX. If you install the Trooper half-shafts on the VX green cup, you could cause some wear to the green cup. Several of us have switched out the green cup/inner shaft to a Trooper cup because of the large availability of Troopers parts. For mild off-roading, it maybe better to pick up an aftermarket half-shaft made by Surtrack which I believe has the same race size as the VX.

2) I think the Trooper wheels are 16" so if I can get those in the deal I'll look at putting some 31's on them. Does anybody know if they are the same offset as ours?
There's a lot of different wheels and packages made for Troopers. There's even wide fender options that probably have specific wheels. Chances are, the rims will be very similar offset to the VX. You can always measure the backspacing to get an idea before you purchase the Trooper rims.

3) I was looking at the Rocky Road sliders unless I make my own. I prefer to have them bolt on. I really don't want to weld to the frame if I can help it and according to Rocky Road theirs bolt on. (Like your idea on the hitch Joe but I'm going to fabricate my own hidden hitch style).
Rocky Road makes good quality sliders. They are notorious for being a bit slow filling orders, so order them sooner than later.

4) It looks like the opinion is split on the hand brake. I want to confirm the concept though. My understanding is that the rear left wheel is the drive and the rear right is the slip? In other words, if all four wheels are stuck in the mud then the left rear will spin and the front right one? Then, if the left rear experiences "resistance" the diff engages the right rear? I know that's a bit simplified and obviously depends upon good clutch packs and components.

All I can say is the stock hand brake works great for tricking the LSD. If you want better locking, nothing beats an ARB locker. I used the hand brake for years before upgrading to the ARB.

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I replied above. Good luck with the mods. Moab is a great time and worth making the trip. :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Triathlete

Sue, the vx run was never considered or meant to be an "easy" run. It was meant to be easy enough not to damage a stock vx, but challenging enough to give those new to off reading a good sense of what the vx is capable of.

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Sorry, my bad on terminology...I know it was meant to be doable by a stock VX (vs. easy)....but I have to say some undercarriage scraping to a stock VX is possible. Oh, and I took a 2" chip out of the lip of my stock rim in that boulder field that first year too .

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Originally Posted by Triathlete

And of course it all comes down to perseption. What is easy to one may be difficult to another :D

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Often it all comes down to ..... clearance!:bgwo: :thumbup:

I'd second the suggestion that you get a Surtrack half shaft spare..
..rather than a used Trooper one.

The fit on the Surtrack races/Cv is OEM standard......
..... and given you are not going to be pounding the Pearl ( :p )..
.. should be plenty strong enough for you.

As for the hitch..not sure how a home made 'hidden hitch' variant will help back end protection..
...plus that will presumably involve cutting cladding.

Cheers

Jo

Jo - I know the hidden hitch will not help rear end protection, I just don't want to spend the money on a another hitch option. I'll take my chances on the "butt drag" since I like the look of the hidden option so much better. The cladding trim is so minimal.

Scored big today! I got the skid plates and 4, 16x7 wheels (with proper offset) from a trooper and the guy threw in a high lift jack all for $100! Now I just need to figure out what the largest size tire is I can fit. Thanks everyone for your input.

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Originally Posted by ahdoman

Scored big today! I got the skid plates and 4, 16x7 wheels (with proper offset) from a trooper and the guy threw in a high lift jack all for $100! Now I just need to figure out what the largest size tire is I can fit. Thanks everyone for your input.

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Nice! That's a great deal! Five months to Moab woohoo!

With no lift the largest tire you can run with no or very minimal trimming (unnoticeable) is a 31x10.5 (265/75/R16).
It will also depend on the tire choice...some more aggressive tires run a little bigger.