The last CV you'll ever need....maybe

Talked to Sean today, he's their engineer guy. He's gonna come up with a proposal for me today or tomorrow, it should have 2 options and some ballpark prices. One option will be a full replacement, basically bulletproof axle warrantied just like the other products they offer. This option being the most expensive. The other option he is working on is some upgraded internals for our current setups, so basically the solid center shaft and inner/outer stubs would be retained by the "joints" themselves would be upgraded. This wouldn't fall under there lifetime warranty I don't think but would be alot more cost effective. In this option it would test the strength of the rest of the stock CV parts (the inner/outer stubs and center bar) so that would be why it doesn't fall under the full warranty, but I think they would warranty the parts that they upgrade. How does this sound to you guys? He should be working on a group buy pricing too.

So with option 1 you would get the added slip joint but with option 2 you would not?

I think I'll start saving my 'ching' & go for option 1.

Did I get that right (see attached picture)?

sorta, not sure if we would use the slip shaft, he's working on the design and should be back to me today or tomorrow, but essentially yes. The cost would go down alot for option 2 because the fab time for making the replacement for the green cup and all new stub axles plus the slip shaft if used would add ALOT, figured I'd throw both options out there.

Do you think he can make both options available for us? Option 1 is for those hardcore off-roaders on here and option 2 for the part time off-roaders on here?

I don't think that would be an issue, I'll double check with him when I get his proposal.

This is where we really need input from some of the old members who've broken CVs in the past. Does anyone know what part(s)of the CVs are actually failing? I always assumed the shafts themselves were snapping.

Ram,

Can you also get them to quote us for just the CV boots?

Ascinder,

AFAIK LittleBeast and Marlin are the only ones who have experienced a catastrophic failure. Everyone else has just done the replacement due to torn boots and/or clicking noise. My guess is that the typical failure sequence is as follows:

1. torn boot allowing lubricants to escape and abrasives to enter the CV joint.

2. the inner (star) and outer (green cup) races become worn causing a divet that the balls will jump in and out of during articulation - clicking sound.

3. those divets become so pronounced that the balls actually bind causing the inner race to fracture

4. once the inner race fractures, the longitudinal slip will probably be adequate that it pops the retaining clip loose and the whole assembly falls out.

5. as soon as one end breaks free, the other CV will 'explode' as well.

This is all conjecture on my part of course since I've never actually been inside a CV when it fails.

Alan (bigmeatvx) exploded his at Moab. He said his cage exploded if I recall correctly

I have broken a couple of outer joints (I have been told this is the most common breakage point when wheeling) and in one case I exploded the "cup" on the inner joint. The inner broke during a high speed hill climb in the snow...full throttle, lots of wheelspin, and then the wheel suddenly found traction. Boom.

I have never snapped any portion of the three shafts that make up a CV axle. I think the CV joints will go long before the shafts will shear.

I know of knowone personally that has broken the shafts themselves. All the failures I know of have been the cages exploding.

As far as the slip shaft, I see no need for it unless you have come up with a suspention mod that allows a lot more up/down arrticulation than what our stock suspention will allow (think trophy truck like 22 inch plus of travel). The green cup allows the balls/cage to move about 3 inches to keep the length in ckeck.
I really like the option of being able to replace the ball/cage with a heavy duty option...that would be the route I would be interested in. I have 2 factory and 3 Empi shafts that I can use! The cage removes with a lock ring...pretty east to do.:yesy:

And again thanks to all that are getting this rolling

True Billy, the slip shaft isn't absolutely needed but I'm not sure that the green cup (outer race) provides 3" movement.

The other thing to consider is that it's not just the inner race that gets worn. The outer race wears out at the same rate. If you need to replace your CVs due to wear, it would be best to replace the green cup as well.

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Originally Posted by Triathlete

I know of knowone personally that has broken the shafts themselves. All the failures I know of have been the cages exploding.

As far as the slip shaft, I see no need for it unless you have come up with a suspention mod that allows a lot more up/down arrticulation than what our stock suspention will allow (think trophy truck like 22 inch plus of travel). The green cup allows the balls/cage to move about 3 inches to keep the length in ckeck.
I really like the option of being able to replace the ball/cage with a heavy duty option...that would be the route I would be interested in. I have 2 factory and 3 Empi shafts that I can use! The cage removes with a lock ring...pretty east to do.:yesy:

And again thanks to all that are getting this rolling

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Broke the shaft x2, separate trail runs....nice to meet you Billy:)
As for now, I am good with the OEM sets, I have 5 of em in the garage:)
But I would be interested in some manly boots, the mecatech ripped after a few weeks, the OEM ones were not ripped when I replaced em:flame:

Where those OEM shafts you broke? Don't think they were!:bwgy: I was refering to the OEM shafts.

T4B..the green cup supplies a lot of in/out movement, may not be 3 inches but it is close. As far as replacing the green cups...unless you are prepared to disassemble your diff, not going to happen. They are held in place with lock rings inside the diff.:yesy::(

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Originally Posted by Triathlete

Where those OEM shafts you broke? Don't think they were!:bwgy: I was refering to the OEM shafts.

T4B..the green cup supplies a lot of in/out movement, may not be 3 inches but it is close. As far as replacing the green cups...unless you are prepared to disassemble your diff, not going to happen. They are held in place with lock rings inside the diff.:yesy::(

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Billy, You do not need to dissasemble the diff to get out the stub axles...It is a real pain in the ***** though...you need a tiny pair of snap ring pliers to get the two snap rings and they slide right out after removing the 4 bolts holding the bracket to the axle housing.
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As far as the HD axles...I/We looked into it years ago and it was $$$$ (as did Swordy and Grampa Bob and others)...but mabey things have changed.???

I have broken 3-5 CVs over the years...and most were in the cage-star area...although at least one damaged or even split the green cup in two...and one broke an outer stub inside the hub.

the biggest two problem areas (beyond the obvious cages) are the smallish 17 spline stub axles (necked down to .9" in some areas!!!), both in the diff side, and at the outer hub-side.
I have spent much time and research into this....Even if you went to a superior material like heat reated 300M, you nwould still only gain a marginal amount of strength (10-20%) and the diameter of the spindle is too small to upgrade the axle size. On the diff side, the guys at ARB could make a modified 10 bolt diff with larger side gears (like 30 spline Super 30), and larger carrier bearings, but this would be pricey custom work and require your diff 3rd member to be machined for the lager bearrings.:yeso:
And after all that work and money, you still would be limited by the diameter of the outer stub axle.:mady2:

That is why I have resorted to a project upgrading the whole front end of my VX...to Dana 44 center section, with Toyota 30 spline axles (a full 1.31" dia. almost 50% stronger than the isuzu), CVs and larger brakes and larger Land Cruiser hubs and spindle and berrings....the project is not yet complete though, as I am still gathering all the needed parts...


Keep us posted on the axles and CVs.....

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That is why I have resorted to a project upgrading the whole front end of my VX...to Dana 44 center section, with Toyota 30 spline axles (a full 1.31" dia. almost 50% stronger than the isuzu), CVs and larger brakes and larger Land Cruiser hubs and spindle and berrings....the project is not yet complete though, as I am still gathering all the needed parts...

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If you don't mind me asking, how far along are you. I am stuck right now trying to cut off the A-arm, shock, and steering brackets. I'm about to buy a plasma cutter and go to town. Tried an angle grinder with a cutoff disc and a sawzall and could only get so far. The brackets are too close together to get into the tight corners. I'm going to run a stock dana 60 for now, then upgrade to the RCV60 shafts if I start getting close to breaking anything. :hj: