Battery

Wanted to revisit & get new opinions on Optima batteries as they've gotten older...
Our FJ needs a new battery, we figured we'd get an Optima Yellow top. Called around, looked online for pricing. Called local "Batteries Plus" ....salesguy says "Optimas are made in Mexico as of about 3 yrs ago, they've taken back about 10,000 bad ones, stopped carrying them since quality problems and they've had so many problems with them." Tried to sell us another AGM (I think their house brand, but didn't catch the brand), more CCA, more reserve. Meanwhile, they still sell Optimas on their website....hmmmm,:_thinking

Optima's site says FJ takes a Group 35.
Sales guy rattled off some rapid fire stuff about the physical size of a Group 35 being smaller than the other AGM he recommended, and we'd need that adapter thing to fit (no big deal in my mind) and recommended a different size (can't recall which one), said it would fill up the battery holder area, so it's a "bigger" more powerful battery....:bla::bla::bla:

~We figure we don't need tremendous CCA as our climate is pretty mild. (Yellowtop has 770 @ 32 degrees)
~We don't need a ton of reserve as no monster stereo, amp or winch, etc... (Yellowtop has 100)

I've had a Redtop for 18 months, 0 probs. (Theoretically mine would have been made in Mexico, but I haven't verified that yet)

What's everybody else think / know about Optimas (specifically the yellowtop)?
Anybody know if the ones made in Mexico are really showing higher problems?
Eric do you get to hear the scoop on this kinda stuff from work?
I know several of you mentioned the Diehard Platinum, has more CCA & reserve I believe, and circ pointed out it had a better warranty....but, we're still most interested in the Optima Yellowtop.

Thoughts? Experiences? Problems?

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Originally Posted by Riff Raff

Hmmm, I guess it's true what they say. Anyone who lives in the State of Arizona don't like anything from Mexico.

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:)

Anyway, I have a yellow top in the F150 that has made its way through my last three trucks. I got it in 06, never had a problem. I got it to support my 06 Explorer that I added a fridge, inverter, dvd and so on.
The problem of the optimas not filling your factory spot are easily solved. Its 1/8" steel and he will cut just about whatever pattern you want in the top, just make sure you tell him which way you want it oriented:( If looks are important, and I have seen your hubby's FJ, looks are important, the optima with custom tray is the way to go. Here is a link to the dealer I used for the tray. As I said, it's definitely high quality, and he cuts the top for free within reason, so if he wanted "FJ" or some such, it would be no problemo.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Optima-Battery-B...item41494ff42a

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/IMGP0956.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/IMGP0953.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/IMGP0952.JPG

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Originally Posted by Mark B

Thanks for all the help.
I can't decide between the Die Hard or Optima.
The Optima has a $ 25.00 rebate.
Will do some price shopping this weekend.

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I bought an die hard platinium series and let me tell you this...you can't go wrong with this one.

This is my 2nd die hard & never had any issues with them.

Mines have 880 CCA with 1000 reserve. My horse fires up like a rocket

Ditto on the recommendation for the Diehard Platinum, although I do kinda regret not having a gel-cell like the Optima. The wife's Axiom has a no-name brand battery in it, so when her's goes out I may trade batteries with her and pick up an Optima for the VX. You can't argue with the super-high CCAs on the Diehard though; we did trade batteries for the trip to Wisconsin last winter, and it started up her Axiom in -17 degree weather on our last day there.

Honestly I don't think you can go wrong either way. :thumbup:

Anybody have any feedback on Odyssey batteries?

I run with the "Blue Tops" Marine deep cycle.
They can bounce back from low charge better and they can start a car engine as well as any boat engine.
Battery problems are not on my list.

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Originally Posted by nfpgasmask

Tom, I hope that your experience was with an isolated batch of bad batteries. The RedTop in my VX came out of my Xterra so that battery is going on 5 years for me. I just put a new Optima in my Trooper. I hope it doesn't crap out. :_huh:

Bart

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X2 I got a red top at costco a few months ago (OEM lasted over ten years)

we shal see...

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Originally Posted by VXR

X2 I got a red top at costco a few months ago (OEM lasted over ten years)

we shal see...

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That's good to know! IIRC, when I checked 18 months ago my Costco didn't carry Optima...I'll check them out tomorrow, probably be the best price around if they carry or can order them.

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Originally Posted by VX KAT

That's good to know! IIRC, when I checked 18 months ago my Costco didn't carry Optima...I'll check them out tomorrow, probably be the best price around if they carry or can order them.

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and a good warranty:yesb:

How is a battery selection so difficult? I always thought that a battery with a waranty was still a battery. If it doesn't have a warranty then I wouldn't buy it that way when the cheap turd stops working I can just take it back and replace or refund... maybe I'm missing something that requires our VX's to have a special battery?:_confused

Die hard platinums are gel cell

Sue,
The size difference he was probably talking about is common. Most toyotas take a group 24f battery. A group 35 is the same height and terminal configuration but length wise it is about 2 inches shorter. Any battery hold down made for one will work with the other. If you wait until Monday I'll confirm the fit at work.

As far as quality control I know die hard was made in mexico by JCI for a while and towards the beginning of this year we saw a lot of problems with batteries coming in over filled so they would leak a small amount during the first charge. Other than that the only other quality control issues we see often are with dual post batteries (top and side post) the gel cells the side terminals work lose and you lose connection unless you take the top off and retighten it. The acid batteries with dual posts Labeled SUV batteries we are seeing come in after 18-30 months dead as a doornail. They happily discontinued those batteries last year and the old ones that are dying usually are fully warrantied out. The other is with vented batteries like in vws and other European cars. They just have a tendency to die within a year or two they are replaced under full warranty often as well.


After those problems we switched to a new manufacturer in Pennsylvania affiliated with Deka. So far so good. The new manuf. Batteries are easily identified by an animated logo on them as opposed to just a solid color.

Keep in mind this stuff applies to northern batteries and may be different than the batteries you would get which are designed for the warmer weather of the south.

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Originally Posted by Bob Barker

How is a battery selection so difficult? I always thought that a battery with a waranty was still a battery. If it doesn't have a warranty then I wouldn't buy it that way when the cheap turd stops working I can just take it back and replace or refund... maybe I'm missing something that requires our VX's to have a special battery?:_confused

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Hey BB- Here's my take on it.....No, the VX doesn't take any special battery...us neurotic owners just tend to fuss over things like this a bit more than normal folks..:goof:
I think the Optima has been so popular because of a couple reasons I can think of...it claims to be 15x more vibration resistant, it can be placed in any orientation, it's sealed and won't leak, and maintenance free. Since many VX owners have added high electrical load items such as stereos, amps and lights, etc.., the Yellow top & Blue top "claim" they handle that load "better" than most other batteries. The vibration resistance factor is a key reason Dave & I are interested in them since we drive about 2 miles on dirt/rocky roads every day .

But I guess there's also a bit of illogical reasoning too...it looks good!

And thanks for a ton of good info Eric!

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Originally Posted by VX KAT

But I guess there's also a bit of illogical reasoning too...it looks good!

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Don't forget, the style conscious VX'r wants his or her battery to match their coil packs...:thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Bob Barker

How is a battery selection so difficult? I always thought that a battery with a waranty was still a battery. If it doesn't have a warranty then I wouldn't buy it that way when the cheap turd stops working I can just take it back and replace or refund... maybe I'm missing something that requires our VX's to have a special battery?:_confused

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Kind of hard to do when it dies in the middle of nowhere out on a trail...sometimes its nice having that little bit of insurance.:yesy:

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Originally Posted by Ldub

Don't forget, the style conscious VX'r wants his or her battery to match their coil packs...:thumbup:

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I think that hits the nail on the head. If you didn't care about looks, you would be driving a plain old jeep:) (or an old box shaped blazer)

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Originally Posted by Marlin

I think that hits the nail on the head. If you didn't care about looks, you would be driving a plain old jeep:) (or an old box shaped blazer)

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Under the hood...its more about function then looks! I don't pop the hood so others can gaze at it in awe! Truthfully most would just see a lot of red moab dirt...still.:bwgy:

Sue,

took a look. The FJ calls for a group 27F.. big honkin battery! we dont even stock them. A group 24F will fit but is physically a bit smaller. The group 35 will fit as well, but is even smaller still.

beware, there is a group 27, and a group 24, but unless there is an "F" associated with it, the terminals will be backwards from what you need. Toyota original battery is 710 CCA, but we show batteries as low as 580 being compatible.

hope this helps!

but when I got my free replacement on a 3 year battery the guy actually put in an RV battery which fit fine and worked fine

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Originally Posted by circmand

but when I got my free replacement on a 3 year battery the guy actually put in an RV battery which fit fine and worked fine

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if thats on the VX, that would make sense, a group 34 is a common marine/RV battery, which fits in the VX. thats what I have is the optima blue top which is marine/RV

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Originally Posted by habs10

Anybody have any feedback on Odyssey batteries?

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I'd never heard of Odyssey until you mentioned it. But when researching more on the Optima, I found a few posts on the Toyota 4Runner forum about it, thought I'd share it here. Don't know how accurate it is. ** Remember this is from a Toyota 4Runner forum so it's not pertaining to our VX...just some brief input on Odyssey batteries**

6/20/08 -So here is some interesting info I thought I would put here, as I did not read it in my searching. We have a Group 31 main battery. Typically they are used for commercial use (big rigs etc), and Marine applications, not light trucks. YEAH TOYOTA! Optima now makes batteries in this size, but typically they are special order, stores seem to carry the standard/original size Optima. I have provided the spec's for the stock battery, my Die-Hard (PC2150 essentially) and the Group 21 Optima Yellow Top.

Odyssey PC 1700
875 CCA
1700 CA
142 Minutes Reserve Capacity
68 Amp Hour or 3.4 amps for 20 hours

Optima Group 31 (Yellow Top D31T w/studs or the D31M Blue Top with posts & studs)
900 CCA
1125 CA
155 Minutes Reserve Capacity
75 Amp Hour Battery or 3.75 amps for 20 hours

Die-Hard Platinum (Essentially an Odyssey PC2150)
1150 CCA 2150 CA
205 Minutes Reserve Capacity
100 Amp Hour or 5 amps for 20 hours

Despite the hype the Odyssey 1700 is not better than the stock battery except for cranking power and construction type. It has 22 less amp hours, and 23 minutes less reserver capacity
The Proper Odyssey Battery would be the PC2150. Why buy it though when you can get a Die-Hard that is the same battery for less $$$?
The Optima's are a great battery, and perform better than stock by a lot (in the right Group 31 size) but are not the equal for the Group 31 Odyssey/Die-Hard Platinum
Marine Batteries are rate for deep cycle and for some reason are also rate to be able to be fully charged in less than an hour. Presumably this means they can take high current recharging better than standard battery's, or Yellow Tops even. They also seem to be rated to be able to be fully discharged 300 times in their life, where the other types will not tolerate this abuse, again not even Yellow Tops. I cannot remember/find again where I saw this in my searching but it was very interesting to me.
Reserve Capacity is the how long a battery will go dead (below 10.2 volts I believe) at a 25amp load. This essentially simulates how long you could run your car with lights on after the alternator dies. This is NOT a measure of a battery's deep cycle capability.
Amp Hours is a strange spec. It gives us an idea of hour much load is required to flatten a battery (again 10.2 volts I believe) in 20 hours. This is THE measurement of a Deep Cycle battery. If you take the Amp Hour Rating and divide it buy the 20 hours you can see the load it can handle to last 20 hours before it is dead. Look at the spec's above, the stock battery blows the Optima and Odyssey 1700 away. I found this very interesting.

Apart from the specs listed there is a far more important aspect to batteries, and that is how long it lasts and can handle abuse. Heat, discharging to low voltage, rapid charges up to 100A or more, etc. Odyssey is rated very highly on the abuse factor and I guess we will find out over time how good they really are for our application.

Bottom-line of what I learned, as long as we choose a battery that is over the 710CCA the stock battery had we should be focused on 2 things only. We want to get the most Amp Hours in a battery we can (for winching, fridges etc) and construction type (gel etc for durability in the abuse we give it). I hope this helps the next guy/gal.

After having too many die hard's "die hard", optimas are the way to go. though a few people have talked about the blue tops, stay away as they do not work (at least in my experience) for road vehicles too well. as for the red and yellow, I prefer the yellow, though have never really had a problem with either.

Though if you are bound and determined for a lead-acid, the stinger accessory batteries make a great primary battery as well... :)

I had a problem with both the red and yellow - don't let them sit too long and Optimas are alright.

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Originally Posted by ZEUS

I had a problem with both the red and yellow - don't let them sit too long and Optimas are alright.

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Just out of curiosity what is too long? Are we talking days or weeks?