Any home audio geeks out there?

ive been looking around for different components... i keep coming back to yamaha though, nothing else is really appealing to me, ive looked at a few sony units... but i despise sony car audio, so id rather not put sony audio in my home (but i loooooooove sony tvs)... so more than likely ill be going yamaha again

as for surround speakers.. ive never heard any complaints about bose power handling... a friend of mine works at a bose store and when he saw my 901s he told me about the demo they do with them....apparently they take a 220v outlet and run wires directly from the outlet to the speaker and the speaker doesnt blow!... ive got pioneer satellite speakers right now 100 watt power handling, they sound good (especially for the under $200 price tag) if i upgrade those ill be upgrading to the JBL Studio Series

Mount them in the ceiling!

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Originally Posted by biju

I like the idea of digital amplification, and the technology sound extremely promising. Know of any good A/V receivers with digital amplifcation that offer HDMI out?

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The JVC's D-series (presumably the D is for 'digital') appear to have switchable HDMI, including upscaling from analog sources too. However, for the price difference, I would just buy a 3x1 or 5x1 "learning" switch and use that with the Panasonic - here's one company that sells a 5x1 for $200 -
Octava. There are others too, that's just the first that came up in google.

The only technology that I see in any other receivers that is worth a damn (e.g. is not just marginally useful tech to justify releasing a new model each year) is DRC (digital room correction). Denon has licensed Audssey's MultiEqxt for their current 3xxx models and up, and Pioneer has their own MCCAC stuff which, last I checked, was not quite as sophisticated as Audssey's software.

DRC is really good stuff - it works through use of a microphone to get "a map" of the way your speakers sound in your room at the places where you sit and then it uses fancy signal processing (the better versions of DRC do more than just equalization because they take into account sound-wave cancellation and reinforcement in the time-domain) to change what comes out of the speakers so that what eventually gets to your ears is closer to the original sound. It ain't perfect, but it can make $100 speakers sound like $1000 speakers.

Early DRC equipment by companies like TacT used to cost $10K, or you had to use a PC with specialized software that is not too user friendly. But that's changing with companies like Denon and Pioneer and if I were to pay a premium for anything beyond the Panasonics, it would have to have DRC.

Another alternative is partial DRC for bass-only, most of the worst room problems are in the lower frequencies because they have longer wavelengths making interference patterns more pronounced. The cream of the crop for bass-only DRC is the Velodyne SMS-1 - here is a review of the SMS-1 I myself have a jerry-rigged home-brew bass-correction system I put together long before there was anything like the SMS-1 on the market and it really does make a huge difference in the quality of the bass. The room graphs in the review are typical of the kinds of problems have with bass in their systems and it really does make an audible difference.

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Originally Posted by biju

BOSE! I keep coming back to that brand for the small surrounds I seek - however, not too sure about their power handling? Are there any other small speakers like BOSE (quality/rep/price) that could handle more power if needed? I'm a little spooked by the smokey death of your Yamaha however, like you said it could have been a fluke. What did you end up replacing it with? (or what do you plan to replace it with?)

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Bose has one of the most well-known, and well-thought of brands on the market. But that's only because they spend tons and tons of money on marketing. I'm sure you've seen more tv and print commercials for bose than for any other speakers by at least a couple of orders of magnitude - who else besides bose even advertises speaker systems on tv? No one. All that advertising costs beacoup bucks - and then there is the cost of those dedicated mall stores - that real-estate is ex-pen-sive. All those costs come out of your wallet when you buy Bose.

Because of all that wasted money, they are universally reviled by people who have gone past the "average consumer" stage of home-audio purchasing. Just read the discussions on any serious home-audio/home-theater website and you will see that Bose is everyone's favorite whipping boy. The whole "better audio through better marketing" approach really tends to piss people off when they realize how badly they've been had.

In less emotional terms - Bose is like Monster Cable - a decent quality product that is hugely over-priced. If you go with any of the less-advertised brands in the market, you will get significantly more bang for the buck. FWIW, if you want a shock, ask 9tinyfingaz how much mark-up there is on the Monster Cable products that CompUSA carries.

Ugh... lots of information and such to digest...

Take this FWIW, I see most of this stuff all day everyday, while moreso commercially than residential. The concepts, applications, and products are similar enough.

For the receiver, while Integra, Yamaha, and Denon (list in order) are good products, The Arcam is SO much better standing heads and shoulders over the Denon, a head above the Yamaha, and a bit over the Intergra, why look further? I really think you need to go audition it and give it a run. Also I will search and see where has both products (Arcam/Integra) so you can listen back to back. not knocking Yamaha, they make a quality product, but I have seen far less issues with either Arcam or Integra. And with the Arcam, hard to argue British quality when refereced to audio.

Speakers... Those are a decent selection of entry level speakers, but going with the Paradigm, I would think you are in a level higher than what you have been looking for.
Have you ever considered B&W? They are incredible, and I was very pleased with how they turned out, and we outfitted a high profile client's home in Aspen with them. HIGH bang for the buck here.

How about:
JosephAudio? They are decent and sound good, worth a listen.
NHT? Great sound for a lower price point.

Taking me to B&O, while not a bad product in quality, function, design it really isnt for me. Biggest reason is you can get SOOO much more for less, why bother with them.

Next up is Bose, the old monniker is VERY true "No highs, no lows, it's gotta be BOSE!"
These guys are living off a reputation buoilt in the 70s and 80s when they HAD a decent product. Not the case anymore, and much like Sony, living off a reputation from the past but have really cut corners in the mass production realm. Like B&O, WAY overpriced for what you get, not to mention the speakers are NOT effecient at ALL!
Takes way to much power to even come close to driving them anywhere near a level where they might sound good, on a day that the planets align, with the wind coming from the south east @ 10MPH, with a relative humidity of 69%, with a 20% chance of precipitation...
but I digress. These "big name vendors" that are in every mall, etc in the country have to, like the previous poster implied, pay their rent somehow and who do you think pays for it? thats right, you do.

Which brings me to Monster cable and the other interconnects that you pay 1000 times more than you need to. Ill tell ya, the raw cable, and connectors I use on a daily basis not only looks no different, it tests out no different than the monster, et all stuff. So, why pay $50 for a cable when it could be done for $5?

The in-wall stuff, while it is good for stealth looks, and you can do so in a way that it is imperceptable to the human eye. Very trick, but very expensive. There are products that exist for in wall that are aimable, and directional. For my money, I would just get some decent cup and ball mounts from either the ceiling hanging down and in, or the wall. Either way, with the ball mount, VERY easy to aim the speaker for optimal imaging.

With the plasma, it doesnt buzz right away, it develops after a few hours of use. Typically within a month of install I have been called back. Havent dealt with the Dell much, so I cant say, I suspect that they are rebadging a Samsung anyway. Which BTW, has been better than that LG/Zenith brand. Have had HUGE issues with them. What size did you end up with?

I really can go on and on, but I think I have spewed enough info for now. As with all things YMMV. I can only share what experiences and opinions gathered from those experiences.
Let me know if you need assistance or additional info.

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Originally Posted by WyrreJ

FWIW, if you want a shock, ask 9tinyfingaz how much mark-up there is on the Monster Cable products that CompUSA carries.

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50-80% mark up on monster cable 20-30% mark up on BOSE. Good thing i can give discounts huh?

Biju, with a budget like that, just get one of those full surround sound kits. They usually come with at least a 5.1DD/DTS reciever, a dvd player, and a full 6 speaker set. I have seen some pretty decent ones at even Best Buy. It is in my nature to knock those kind of kits since my audio/visual setup at home runs about $18k in total, but I have a buddy who spent $900 of a Yamaha kit at Best Buy and he grabbed a 40" LG LCD tellie for about $1400, and it nearly rivals mine! Simply amazing stuff out there that you DONT have to pay a lot for. Just keep that in mind.

I am thinking of giving my mom my 48" Mistubishi HD widescreen since her tv just popped and getting myself a 65" plasma finally. Can get my hands on one under $4k finally so it may be a fun purchase.

BTW, just to get the geek factor going strong.... we are having a custom 16 FOOT digital widescreen put in at work. Along with a 160 person theater seating for it. Isnt supposed to be ready until Xmas-next year, but man, if that isnt incentive to WANT to stay and work late nights, heh.

While not perfect, here is an option that might work in your situation:

http://www.yamaha.com/yec/YSP1/idx_ysp1000.htm

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Originally Posted by WormGod

BTW, just to get the geek factor going strong.... we are having a custom 16 FOOT digital widescreen put in at work. Along with a 160 person theater seating for it. Isnt supposed to be ready until Xmas-next year, but man, if that isnt incentive to WANT to stay and work late nights, heh.

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Yep, we installed a 25 FOOT (22'x11.5') HD front projection set up last year at Denali National Park for 150 seat theater.

That was AWESOME, and the HD player source we utilized was sweet. Fully automated with the black out shades, lights, start/stop, narration etc.

Crestron is your friend. That had about 15,000 Watts of power. Couple 15" driver towers for the L/R with a matched center. 10" drivers for the surrounds (12 in all), and dual 18" subs.

During testing we hit 145dB in the center of the seating area. It was loud, they are not even utilizing 30% of the available headroom on the system. The projector was pretty kickass, we had to turn it to 50% lamp power (dual lamp @ low poer setting).

Fun stuff we play with...

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Originally Posted by WormGod

BTW, just to get the geek factor going strong.... we are having a custom 16 FOOT digital widescreen put in at work. Along with a 160 person theater seating for it. Isnt supposed to be ready until Xmas-next year, but man, if that isnt incentive to WANT to stay and work late nights, heh.

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I had a lot of fun helping design and install a 3x2 Clarity DLP wall at my current employer's campus for the IT command center. They got screwed on the video controller and ended up going with a PC with 3 Nvidia Quattro's instead. It would be great for video nights but they got weird about the idea and wouldn't let me set all the gear up. Oh well. Maybe I'll finish designing my controller idea anyways ;)

There's some cool technology in that space if you're willing to deal with the bezels. It's only really useful in a commercial setting though.

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Originally Posted by Tobert

I had a lot of fun helping design and install a 3x2 Clarity DLP wall at my current employer's campus for the IT command center. They got screwed on the video controller and ended up going with a PC with 3 Nvidia Quattro's instead. It would be great for video nights but they got weird about the idea and wouldn't let me set all the gear up. Oh well. Maybe I'll finish designing my controller idea anyways ;)

There's some cool technology in that space if you're willing to deal with the bezels. It's only really useful in a commercial setting though.

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What controller were they trying to use?
While the solution you ended up with isnt bad, it just has some limitations that a standard controller would not.

Did a 4x8 matrix wall a while back and that was pretty cool, albeit a lot of work 50" cubes, Yeah a full image was insane!

But anyway, we are getting off track, where IS Bill anyway? :p

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Originally Posted by Locomigo

What controller were they trying to use?

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It was a Jupiter 950 somebody got off the back of a truck, as far as I can tell. We even bought a warranty and had it to Jupiter and back and it STILL didn't work. Junk. I hear their more modern stuff is better, but I wouldn't buy another product from them.

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Originally Posted by Locomigo

While the solution you ended up with isnt bad, it just has some limitations that a standard controller would not.

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Yeah, I know. I wanted to build something much more sophisticated (could handle full-screen video and arbitrary partitioning/positioning), but it would have taken me a couple months to build from scratch. Still, it would be MUCH cheaper to build than even the low-end controllers on the market cost.

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Originally Posted by Locomigo

Did a 4x8 matrix wall a while back and that was pretty cool, albeit a lot of work 50" cubes, Yeah a full image was insane!

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I'm envious. This is just a medium-size company that was already over budget on the system. It'd be fun to work with a fully tricked out system.

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Originally Posted by Locomigo

But anyway, we are getting off track, where IS Bill anyway? :p

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Originally Posted by Tobert

It was a Jupiter 950 somebody got off the back of a truck, as far as I can tell. We even bought a warranty and had it to Jupiter and back and it STILL didn't work. Junk. I hear their more modern stuff is better, but I wouldn't buy another product from them.

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The Jupiters are the controller of choice for us, although Christie isnt a bad choice.

For the Jupiter, we have only had one out of 150+ that we've put in flake on us.
I am pretty happy with them and their support they provide.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand, waiting for Bill to reply to some of the questions. etc I through out there.

I dont claim to be the be all end all to this stuff, but between car, residential and commercial, I have been in A/V for a long time and seen a lot of different things. Happy to help anyone.

Hey fam:

Just haven't had the time today at the salt mine to respond. I'm crazy busy today... I'll be on tonight tho. Sounds like a good opportunity to use the chat room?!!!

-biju.

nope.. wont be around....

Arcam offerings looks excellent, but extremely expensive!! If I went that route, I'd have to nix the surround speakers all together just to afford one of their receivers. I don't wanna do that...

Remember, I'm going for 'dabbling' in higher end (yet affordable) components.

All in all I have/had 4k to purchase a receiver, cd player, front stage (monitors & center), subwoofer, surrounds, accessories. The Arcam receiver that offered HDMI output is being offered at $2999. Way too much for my situation.

After seeing that, I went ahead and purchased the Yamaha RX-V2600 just last night. Got a good deal on it ($950 which includes an extended 3yr warranty). After the monitor/sub set up I picked up (roughly $1400), I'm left with roughly $1,650 to purchase the surrounds, CD player, and accessories... (I already have a solid Samsung DVD player w/ HDMI upconversion, etc.)

Can it be done?

-biju.