Ozone injection??

[Maverick]

just curious if anyone on here tried this.. Im considering testing an "ozone injection reactor."
this is basically a device similiar to a household air purifier. shoot ionized particle at an air stream creating ozone (densly packed o2 in a nutshell) and has a by product of no2 (nos) in very small amounts. the gismo installs upstream of the air intake, and according to the mad scientist, the resulting "stream" of ozone and byproduct no2 optimises fuel burn, slightly increases hp due to clean burn, improves economy, and reduces emissions..
i thought it was bs at first, but after thinkng about it it kind of makes sense, and now im seriously considering trying it in my vx..
just curious if anyone else has examined or used somehting like this??

[Joe_Black]

Just do a search in Google or Yahoo! for "increase mileage" and take your pick of all the devices and gizmos available. Or get several and produce your own fuel while you drive to pick up free money the government has for you now! ;Do;

Seriously, the gasoline internal combustion engine by it's very design is only around 35% efficient. Diesels are marginally better due to the higher compression design and better energy density of the fuel. But if there was really a better, more efficient engine that could be mass produced you'd be driving it now. Why? Because whoever owned that technology would be the most wealthy and powerful outfit in the world. And people don't hide that kind of power.

Wouldn't you seriously consider running right down to the dealership and buying a vehicle that got 100MPG or more? Of course you would, and there's not a company around that doesn't know it. That's why it's so easy to sell any kind of magic device that can be made to sound reasonable, especially when the potential gains are very minor and therefore easier to quantify to potential marks.

[Maverick]

this is a private party and the devise is not being marketed (not by the individual im talking to anyhow) .. i dont know of others or if its "concept" been packaged before, thats why im asking..
ive also talked to another private party who uses a device similiar to this (unrelated in any way to the first guy, they dont know each other exist so far as i know, also has a homebrew ozone injector) he claims a 10 mpg agerage increase, says his car has increased acceleration, but doesnt know jack about hp and doesnt care..
anyhow, neither one is really hyping what theyve done,they handbuild the units and their crude looking, and neither seem to have the resources for any sort of mass marketing..they just sell a few on occasion from word or mouth basically. and i cant find any other info it. im hoping there a chemist or two hanging around that can look at this objectively and post their opinions on it..

let me put the question in a differrent way..

what would be the expected results of injecting a stream of raw ozone(and the byproducts of its manufacture) into the intake plenum??

if you think about it, it really makes more sense than nitrous injection does, assuming what little ive been told holds up...but i may be missing something..so please, lets remove the "gimmick " factor that people automatically assume, and put some real thought into it...I know there are tons of gimmicks out there with wild claims, but ive known of several potentially "world changing" inventions that were simply dismissed for various reasons, so i ve learned to always try to be objective about these things..


added: ive found one document that seems to suport this process, a pdf, but its a deisel study , im trying to get through it a little at a time :http://scholar.lib.vt.edu/theses/available/etd-583512259711521/unrestricted/ETD.PDF


In June 1993, an inventor found that supplying ozone through the intake manifold
improved the performance of his gasoline fueled car. As a result of these findings, he approached
the Science Applications International Corporation (SAIC) who then following his lead and
investigated his discoveries further. SAIC conducted experimental tests on a 1993 Lincoln Town
Car to determine the effects of ozone addition on the exhaust emissions of gasoline engines. The
testing results supplied convincing evidence of reduced levels of NOx and UHC in the exhaust
gases. However, SAIC did not have enough resources to perform an extensive parametric study. interesting isnt it??

[Ldub]

All this sounds somewhat familiar...during my s/c install, my crackhead neighbor came over with about 20 pages of info. on "reverse supercharging" (exhaust scavenging),complete with plans for "megaphone" headers & a George Jetson meets Mad Max intake that was too strange. I thanked him kindly...but no thanks.
As far as an ozone converter...who knows?...might work, at least your engine compartment would smell fresh like a spring rain.


;Db;

[Joe_Black]

It's very good to be open minded and objective, and I apologize if my response came across a bit strong. I'm showered with questions about various things of this nature from a variety of industries, so it's difficult sometimes to temper my response.

In being objective, some research is in order. At first glance, ozone seems a good "enrichment" for combustion because of it's 3 oxygen atoms. But using this thought process could lead you to fill your tank with water because with 2 oxygen atoms and 1 hydrogen it should be a fantastically flammable fuel. So, first, get a good understanding of what actually ozone is and the effects it has: What is Ozone? (http://www.epa.gov/iaq/pubs/ozonegen.html)

Take a look at some comparitive mileage-increasing "technologies" and see how much they slander each other. Here's a hydrogen-injection system that mentions ozone injection: Hydrogen-Boost. (http://www.hydrogen-boost.com)

Here's an interesting discussion at halfbakery.com: http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/ionizing_20intake_20air_20for_20better_20performan ce#1088874000 (You have to copy-n-paste the link, sorry!)

Here's some general common-sense knowledge for increasing fuel economy: Get Better Gas Mileage. (http://www.tristatechillers.com/other/car_and_driver/car_tips.html)

Of course you could harness the natural power of magnets to increase your fuel economy: Fuel Master. (http://moremiles4u.com/)

There's all kinds of stuff out there. Spend some time with Yahoo! and Google, it's amazing the things you'll find. ;Do;

[thedutchguy]

Why don't we all do a search!
Lets search for a pil, you know the one you put in your tank and your vx does 0-60 in 4 secs and you never have to visit the pump again!
Those pils, they do exist don't they? ;Dy;

[Maverick]

yeah, i could use one of those magic pills.. :)

quick true story: my grandfather was an automotive engineer and scientist, way back in the fourties he and a group of fellow "einstein" types actually invented a combustion engine that did indeed run on water. one of them dissapeared shortly before they were going to announce it publically, and their lab was "mysteriously" torched and burned to the ground. the protype and almost all data was destroyed, annonymous threats were recieved by everyone of the remaining group, indicating their families would "dissapear" next if they continued their work..
he destroyed his notes and never talked about it again, except in very brief reflections.. he was a very fact driven man with a checklist mentality , and never endorsed anything until he had verified the facts himself..all we know is he did give some of the remaining "blueprints" to someone he thought might one day redevelope the concept, he never said who it was, to anyone, so far as we know..he was also a very humble man and never took credit for anything he invented(or the money)..he just gave the designs to the people he thought would do the most good with it..one of those inventions was the microwave oven, which he developed in the 20's...
many thought he was nuts, and he probably was to some extent, but he was just as briliant, and way ahead of his time..
anyhow, point is, there are inventions out there that are dismissed and not taken seriously, at the moment.. and their are many entities out there today that will still try and crush the little guy if they see them as a threat..
i try and keep my eyes and mind open to such things, but the vast majority are just gimmicks..
i do see some very interesting things with this ozone injection concpet though..im going to to keep researching it for a bit and see what else i can come up with..

[SlowPro48]

And this thing goes in your intake? Doesn't seem like there would be any advantage in turning 3 diatomic oxygen molecules into 2 ozone molecules. (3)O2 ---> (2)O3 There is no net gain in oxygen.

If it's actually adding oxygen (as ozone) from outside the intake then it's probably in the PPM range at best. Those big ones for the home only manage to generate in the PPB range.

Sounds like a gimmick to me...

[Heraclid]

Pills for your VX, eh? I can just see the ads now...

"With the extra get up and go, it's like Viagra for your truck!"

Richard Cranium - Climax, GA
Another satisfied PowerBallz user

[Maverick]

Originally posted by SlowPro48
And this thing goes in your intake? Doesn't seem like there would be any advantage in turning 3 diatomic oxygen molecules into 2 ozone molecules. (3)O2 ---> (2)O3 There is no net gain in oxygen.

If it's actually adding oxygen (as ozone) from outside the intake then it's probably in the PPM range at best. Those big ones for the home only manage to generate in the PPB range.

Sounds like a gimmick to me...

okay, ive been reading up a little, and i think (maybe) i have the answer to this..
o2 pretty much stays as is, as its stable. o3, is rather unstable and its third likes to attach itself to other things as soon as it can. now, since the average auto only burns about 20% to 30% of the fuel you feed it (the rest goes out the exhaust tube), the third molcule attaches to the "extra" fuel molecules and allows it to burn (when normally it wouldnt.) so the net effect is increased burning effieiceincy(sp?).. i think..
chemistry was never my thing, so im not sure if this is correct, but this is what ive gathered from reading some very brainy type pdf papers ive found, mostly to do with pollution control.. the stuff gives me a headache..
i havent found anything that deals directly with ozone injection except what ive posted above. for some reason im very intrigued about this idea, i hope i can find more info that i can actually understand on the topic..

[Heraclid]

Hey Lawrence, no kidding, I came up with that because I actually saw a place called Richard Cranium's in Bismarck the last time I was in North Dakota. I believe it was a nightclub. And Climax is a real town in Georgia. Somewhere I think we have a picture of my brother next to the sign.