How far can i lift suspension? how big tires can i fit?

[*albino*batman*]

Hi All. Im new here. Bought the VX a week ago from a guy who had it for his wife and did not know what it was.
had it in the garage as it was banging from the front suspension. turns out he Blisten shock's bottom bush was missing. Made one out of exhaust hanger and that seems to have provided a temp fix. i will replace them both when the poly bush ones turn up.
So i figured is flip the upper ball joints as its a quick job and wind the front torsion bars a little (about 3 turns). its only about 2-3mm of clean thread above the cross member so i was wondering if i can go any more?
will the bump stops need replacing / removing / cutting down?
i also have yellow springs on the rear. these may be aftermarket and longer but i cannot know as they were on it when i got it. i have ordered some 2" metal spacers that are custom made for troopers so should fit. is there a limit i can go on the rear?
the reason for this is its currently running on 16" 7j OZ rally alloys with Runway 265/75/16s on and they look too small. id like to go with some big chunky 285/75/16 MTs (geolanders) or if i can 315/75/16 Maxxis MT762s which will be HUGE but will need to go on 9j or 10j as far as i can make out.

His is not my daily drive. its a toy. practicality is not my priority here.

so. to recap:

1) how much can i lift my suspension without SERIOUS mods?
2) how big a tyre can i fit with that lift?

here is a picture as it now stands.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-15%2013.38.38.jpg

[bartmanS4]

You're definitely lifted now, you will just need to trim your front cladding to allow for bigger tires. Here is a good link for you to start with:
http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=14685

I've got about the same amount of lift as you do and I'm running 33/12.5r15 without any problem after trimming the cladding. Much bigger than that and you'll probably need a body lift, diff drop, ball joint flip, etc.

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/NewSide2.JPG

[JoFotoz]

This may well help too....

.
www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=15476

The "Holy Grail" of lift info :thumbup:

jo

[*albino*batman*]

think is, my tires are now closer together at the bottom than the top (camber?)
i believe this was supposed to be countered when i flipped my ball joints. has this made for too much camber? should i flip the ball joints back? or wind the front torsion bars in a few more turns hoping to jack the front up a bit more and thus bring the top of the tires closet together? How much can i wind the front torsion bar adjusters? all the way? whats a safe ammount?

[*albino*batman*]

bartmans4, what tires are them? thelook sweet.

[Triathlete]

After flippi g ball joints and cranking torsion bars you HAVE TO GET AN ALIGNMENT done.

[*albino*batman*]

get an alignment done by who exactly. my pal has a 4 wheel laser alignment jig at work but its a tyre fitter type place (kwikfit). will it need specific isuzu parts etc? what does it involve? there are only about 20 of these things in the UK so nobody has ever come across one before.

[Triathlete]

Any reputable alignment shop should be able to do it. No special parts are needed. By turning the tbars and/or flipping ball joints you changed the geometry of the front suspension, thet are simply getting it back by adjusting it.

This explains an alignment (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheel_alignment)

[JoFotoz]

Any "good" tire place...


get an alignment done by who exactly. my pal has a 4 wheel laser alignment jig at work but its a tyre fitter type place (kwikfit). will it need specific isuzu parts etc? what does it involve? there are only about 20 of these things in the UK so nobody has ever come across one before.

...will do your alignment, its not Isuzu specific equipment.

So YUP..your mate at kwikfit :thumbup:

Some will even do a 3 year/5 year / lifetime unlimited package deal.

If you are going to go off road, a package deal is a good plan,
cause checking the alignment regularly will save on bad tire wear.


:_beer:

jo

.

[Triathlete]

^^^ You type to slow old man! :D

[*albino*batman*]

ok, ill book it in. the question i really need answering is... how much can i adjust the front torsion bars? i think i need to go a bit further up but dont want to brake anything.

[JoFotoz]

There are several VX's here with 35 inch tires...

...using standard torsion bar crank method.

Mine included..

So unless you are going crazy ..dont worry.

When you crank the T'bars, index the bolts ( mark them) before turning...
...then turn both as equally as possible.

This helps minimize alignment issues and keeps everything 'equal' each side.

Jo

[bartmanS4]

bartmans4, what tires are them? thelook sweet.

Thanks! Them be Goodyear MT/R s

[JoFotoz]

Said the hare...



^^^ You type to slow old man! :D

....to the tortoise!


:_steering


Jo

[*albino*batman*]

OK, update. i have 3" spring spacers on order and i pick up a set of 5 Maxxis Creepy Crawler 35x12.5x16 on 0 Offset steel modulars on Tuesday (2nd hand ebay bargain).

Obviously i need a fair bit of lift for the 35" crawlers, having chunky side lugs and all but will i have to trim the cladding? if so can i just chop it away where it rubs or is there anything specific i can do to keep the trimming down to a minimum?

Gonna have to put a roof rack on o keep my spare 35x12.5 wheel! maybe put a nice 12" sub in the rear door card in place of the space saver!

Pics to follow

[JoFotoz]

You will need some.... :thumbup:

Front
====

YES!
Certainly a fair bit at BOTTOM back of front arches...:smack:
Remove lower ARCH LINER ( OR CUT IT, I DID)..Cut away some of metal .. hammer back etc.. ..re-cover with arch liner......
...nothing structural under there. Small 'not required' pressed metal cross brace.. mines gone..no issues.

Pics in my gallery

AND.. some of lower lip of front cladding.. bit by bit till you do enough IMO!
It'll rub more on sharp turns.


Back
===

Shouldnt need any, though your wheels will rotate fwd a bit given lift.
A few of us with 35's have fitted adjustable rear links in order to center wheels again...

...plus lengthened the rear drive shaft to restore spline depth in yolk.


Hope this helps.. holla if ya need more.

Jo

[VX KAT]

with 0 offset rims, (OEM are +38) you'll have a fair amount of trimming just to fit those, plus what Jo said to fit the 35s. :smack::smack:

I put -2 rims and went 1" wider than OEM, so I had lots of trimming and :smack: to fit them.

[RabidPony]

My VX is lifted with OME 913 springs, torsion bar crank, and Indy 4X extended brake lines. My tires are Geolandar MT's at 285/75 16. With minor fender trimming they fit perfect. And there is minimal impact on handling.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/RabidPony98/IMG_1866_zps543b4f80.jpg (http://s4.photobucket.com/user/RabidPony98/media/IMG_1866_zps543b4f80.jpg.html)
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/RabidPony98/IMG_1852_zpsbcfc9048.jpg (http://s4.photobucket.com/user/RabidPony98/media/IMG_1852_zpsbcfc9048.jpg.html)

[JoFotoz]

Yup...BUT.


My VX is lifted with OME 913 springs, torsion bar crank, and Indy 4X extended brake lines. My tires are Geolandar MT's at 285/75 16. With minor fender trimming they fit perfect. And there is minimal impact on handling.

I believe yours are 33 ish... arent they?

He's fitting 35's...

...that extra 2 inches is all it takes!


:smack:

Jo

[*albino*batman*]

well we will see tomorrow when i get them. may well need to cut / hammer / bend / flex / brake / cry my VX. ill do some before / during / after shots.

thinking i might fit a bit of a body lift before cutting away the cladding. might be better in long run. an inch or so might do it.

[VXorado]

thinking i might fit a bit of a body lift before cutting away the cladding. might be better in long run. an inch or so might do it.

That's what I did when I fitted the 35" tires. Pros & Cons: less drivetrain stress :thumbup: less offroad clearance :thumbdn:

[JoFotoz]

The "Surgery" to fit 35's sounds worse than it really is!

Jons VX with Body lift, and mine with suspension lift both sit about
the same height, and I do get better ground clearance...

...but we do all the same trails together in Moab.....

..so it works either way :thumbup:

Jo

[*albino*batman*]

Like i said, this is going to mainly be a aesthetic modification, and although i want the option of being able to handle massive boulders like your sig pic, in reality i doubt i will be at it every weekend. i bought this car because i loved the look of it. i also have a 4.7 v8 Grand Cherokee. i do not need another 4x4 but at least i can play about with this without worrying too much about its practicality. i think it will look a bit special sat on 35" crawlers. maybe something like rabid pony's as thats the look im going for.
I pul my Jetski about with my van most of the time. its a bit dull. i fancy turning up with a big off-road beast on the beach. VX ticks all the boxes.

[tom4bren]

I pul my Jetski about with my van most of the time. its a bit dull. i fancy turning up with a big off-road beast on the beach. VX ticks all the boxes.

Yah, I get lotsa comments when I tow my twin pack of SeaDoos behind the Proton. :) It helps that they are all matching too!

[*albino*batman*]

OK, so i did a little testing today. not bothered with the spring spacers on the back. it seems to be lifted enough and the front has had the torsion bars wound down last weekend. The backs went on fine. the fronts rubbed some so i trimmed a bit of plastic and cut a bit of the metal out of the rear of the front arch. The right side is done new with enough clearance for full lock. The left side will be done tomorrow. then im having a 4 wheel laser alignment, then im going out to play.
Pictures so far...
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-25%2015.38.33.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-25%2017.45.01.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-25%2017.45.15.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-25%2017.50.22.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-25%2017.50.47.jpg

so far so good.

[JoFotoz]

Cool..Looks good...

...but FYI, under compression / off road...more trimming may be required...
...so be prepared for that!

You can also see in pic 2 , the rear wheel is now sitting forward in the arch...

.... if this becomes an issue, adjustable rear links from Indy 4x4 are the cure!

Jo

[*albino*batman*]

what are the best roof bars to put on to get a roof basket as low down as possible? Gonna have to put the spare on top like yours Jo

[JoFotoz]

""The Best"" are OEM bars IMO...


what are the best roof bars to put on to get a roof basket as low down as possible? Gonna have to put the spare on top like yours Jo

...but super hard to find, expensive...and a tad high for some people.

Check VXorados rig... IIRC he has a different, lower profile option he customized.

jo

[*albino*batman*]

OK, so the wheels are on, the arches are trimmed and they don't catch any more. Next issue i have encountered...... At speed, (20-30mph) if i go over a bump i suddenly start to get a massive speed wobble. its like the wheels are egg shaped. the whole truck seems to hop from side to side. it only stops if i slow down to almost a stop.

[JoFotoz]

Given these were used tires/rims...

...did you get them balanced & aligned after lift?

Hopefully that will cure it.

If not.....wheel bearings ..
...or did used tires sit for a period, have a flat spot?

jo

[Triathlete]

If none of Jo's suggestions fix it, check the upper and lower control arm bushings and the ball joints.

[*albino*batman*]

ok, i checked the tyre pressure. one was 10 psi the other was 40! that a side. i think i will have them all balanced and the laser wheel alignment done. hope that helps as it looks bloody good!

[*albino*batman*]

oh, and whilst i was at it, i carbon wrapped my hood insert...
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-27%2015.22.15.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-27%2015.58.29.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-27%2015.58.40.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12024062/2014-02-27%2015.59.23.jpg
looks good on the car. photo to follow

[*albino*batman*]

there is a bit of play in the front wheel bearing. Is this as specific VX part or is it the same as a Trooper part? bear in mind i have a JDM.
anyone got a part number?

[tom4bren]

While you are looking for replacement bearings, you can tighten the hub nut to decrease the play on that bearing.

[*albino*batman*]

where is the hub nut? under the freewhel hub cover?

[LittleBeast]

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/RabidPony98/IMG_1866_zps543b4f80.jpg (http://s4.photobucket.com/user/RabidPony98/media/IMG_1866_zps543b4f80.jpg.html)
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/RabidPony98/IMG_1852_zpsbcfc9048.jpg (http://s4.photobucket.com/user/RabidPony98/media/IMG_1852_zpsbcfc9048.jpg.html)

Which rock sliders are those? I like!

[tom4bren]

where is the hub nut? under the freewhel hub cover?

Yes. There should be a retainer with 3 little phillips head screws under the hub cover (or locking hub if you have them installed). Once that's removed, you can tighten the hub nut enough to load the bearings but still allow the retainer to be re-installed. Just don't tighten it too much or you'll add drag to that wheel.

I know that sounds confusing but I can picture it in my mind since I've done it before. There's a write-up with pictures for re-packing your bearings. Hopefully it's still available in the download section. If not, lemme know & I can post my copy.

Also note that those 3 little phillips head screws are a real PITA & it's easy to strip the heads. An impact driver will probably be needed. I replaced mine with allen pan head screws.

[evillecutter]

Which rock sliders are those? I like!

rocky road supersliders - i just got a set a few months back they look great - like they should have came on the car

http://www.rocky-road.com/index2.html

make sure you ask for super sliders not rock sliders if you want the ones that stick out