Gallbladder might have to come out

[JAMAS]

Well, after a weekend at the hospital with Pancreatitis, it looks like I will have to have my Gallbladder removed.

Has anyone had experience with that?

Does anything change after the surgery? Diet, etc?

Thanks everyone.

[tom4bren]

Wifey had hers out long before we ever met. AFAIK she never missed it. They go in through your belly button now so you won't even have a scar to brag about.

Best of luck with the procedure ... Keep us posted.

Our prayers will be with you.

[circmand]

Wifey had hers out long before we ever met. AFAIK she never missed it. They go in through your belly button now so you won't even have a scar to brag about.

Best of luck with the procedure ... Keep us posted.

Our prayers will be with you.

The only thing he has ever said is you really have to cut down on the greasy fatty foods as they go through you quick. (just the real bad stuff like real philly cheese steaks)

[tom4bren]

Between what you posted ... & your siggy - that was one mental image I really didn't need this early in the morning. Sorta like waking up to that colon cleaning info-mercial at 2AM.

[vt_maverick]

Got your email this morning Jon, sorry to hear it. But hey, if you need more time on the project there's no need to put yourself in the hospital for an excuse! :eek: :D

My dad just had part of his GI tract removed and I believe the advice he got was the same that you might get - don't go on a 3 mile hike right after you eat unless there are porta-jon's all along the way.

Good luck, hope you feel better!

[JAMAS]

Thanks everyone for your help.

I meet with the surgeon on Thursday to discuss my options.

[mdwyer]

Has anyone had experience with that?

Does anything change after the surgery? Diet, etc?


In theory, the gall bladder is why humans eat a couple times a day instead of grazing the whole time. Without the bladder, you can't store up enough bile to process the fats you eat all at once.

In practice, it only holds about a shotglass-worth of bile, while your body makes about a litre a day. So, your diet should probably trend towards low-fat after the surgery. You'll find that balance yourself pretty quickly, since the fat that doesn't get processed is going to be pretty obvious when it comes out the other side. Ew.

Anyway, my mom recently had hers out via the laproscopic procedure. The surgery went perfectly. She had a bit of pain for about a week, including some shoulder soreness that is a side effect of the inflation that they put you through. Odd.

Near the end of the week, though, she had a pretty severe brain bleed that took her out for something like three months. A stroke /is/ a possible side effect of any surgery, though... what are you gonna do?

I realize that saying, "Other than the stroke, the surgery went great!" is a little like asking, "So, other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?" but ... well, you asked.

[VX KAT]

Sorry to hear this Jon, hope all goes well! Although it's usually removed due to gall stones, many many many people have had it removed and seem to do fine.

[JAMAS]

Although it's usually removed due to gall stones

I should have been more specific...my pancreatitis was due to a gallstone

[VX KAT]

I should have been more specific...my pancreatitis was due to a gallstone
OK, now I've got to make a little funny at your expense...hope it gives you a chuckle.......the "usual" patient with gallstones is...the 5 "F"s......Female, Fat, Forty, Fertile and Fair...


"In medical school, the "five F's" help doctors to remember the usual patient with gallbladder disease: "fair, fat, forty, fertile, and female." Sexist as it sounds, it describes the group most frequently affected by gallbladder disease: overweight middle-aged white women with a history of several pregnancies. Excess estrogen may be implicated, since hormone replacement after menopause increases the likelihood of stones."

[nfpgasmask]

Mother-in-law had hers out 2 or 3 years ago, she's good. :)

Bart

[JAMAS]

OK, now I've got to make a little funny at your expense...hope it gives you a chuckle.......the "usual" patient with gallstones is...the 5 "F"s......Female, Fat, Forty, Fertile and Fair...


"In medical school, the "five F's" help doctors to remember the usual patient with gallbladder disease: "fair, fat, forty, fertile, and female." Sexist as it sounds, it describes the group most frequently affected by gallbladder disease: overweight middle-aged white women with a history of several pregnancies. Excess estrogen may be implicated, since hormone replacement after menopause increases the likelihood of stones."


well thats just Fantastic :)

I had really bad strep throat for a week before my pancreatitis and the first thing I ate (cuz something FINALLY sounded good) after 4 days of not eating was a couple cheese burgers from McDonalds. I was doing some reading and one cause of gallstones is fasting or crash dieting and I am thinking thats what happened. Then I ate something fatty and called my gallbladder into action only to have stones come out instead. All tests they ran say no stones in the gallbladder right now, just evidence that one had passed through. I have to talk to the surgeon on thursday, but I am hoping maybe this was all caused from not eating, then eating fatty and if I dont do that again, I will be fine.

[Anita]

You sure you dont have acid reflux? I can get MEAN attacks due to acid reflux. Pain can be immense and last for hours. Eating too much at one time, eating too late, high-fat foods, stress, etc all can be culprits and exhibit some of the same symptoms as a gallbladder attack.

Oh, the people I know who had gallbladders out did great afterwards. Always a danger with surgeries no matter what, but gallbladder is on the milder side of invasive surgeries IMHO.

[JHarris1385]

DON'T!

We as a country cut the gallbladder out instead of finding the true source of the problem. Look at any other country compared to ours (yes overall we have a worse diet). No other place in the world removes a gallbladder like out docs do. Its is there for a reason.

[vt_maverick]

Which is... to process wonder supplements I bet! :laughy:

J/k, couldn't help but poke a little fun. :o

[JHarris1385]

This hits close to home for me. My wife had hers taken out right before we got together. It was 100% not needed. The only issue was that she was prescribed medicine for acid reflux when that is not what is needed. So nevertheless I am well versed on this subject as you are essentially removing an organ that you need, due to the reccomendation from a doctor that has learned this practice from his lazy predecessor. We used to not do this, the spike has been in the last 10 years. It honestly boils down to money, what costs more....fixing it and a twice a year check up if that? or a surgery, two week, one month, 6 months check up?

[vt_maverick]

So what is "the fix"?

[Mile High VX]

Hey sorry to hear all this. We'll be praying for you.

My wife ignored hers for years and then had to have it out the old fashioned way...ouch.

She only needed to watch her diet until her body adjusted to not having it. She does great now and eats whatever she wants.

[PK]

DON'T!

We as a country cut the gallbladder out instead of finding the true source of the problem. Look at any other country compared to ours (yes overall we have a worse diet). No other place in the world removes a gallbladder like out docs do. Its is there for a reason.

Wow - not sure what your health system is like, but that could be a dangerous diagnosis to make without seeing the patient or knowing the facts.

My brother delayed having his gall bladder removed, and it nearly killed him. Went septic and started to poison him from the inside.
He eventually recovered fully and lives a normal life without any problems.

Jamas, by all means get a second opinion if you want to, but better make it a more informed one than this site.

Good luck man - those stones can be painful.

PK

[VX KAT]

DON'T!

We as a country cut the gallbladder out instead of finding the true source of the problem. Look at any other country compared to ours (yes overall we have a worse diet). No other place in the world removes a gallbladder like out docs do. Its is there for a reason.


This hits close to home for me. My wife had hers taken out right before we got together. It was 100% not needed. The only issue was that she was prescribed medicine for acid reflux when that is not what is needed. So nevertheless I am well versed on this subject as you are essentially removing an organ that you need, due to the reccomendation from a doctor that has learned this practice from his lazy predecessor. We used to not do this, the spike has been in the last 10 years. It honestly boils down to money, what costs more....fixing it and a twice a year check up if that? or a surgery, two week, one month, 6 months check up?

I just gotta say something here. I'm troubled by the word "DON'T" in your first post, and "100% Not needed" in your 2nd post, as well as the word "lazy predecessor". I think it's too far over the line to basically be espousing medical "information" and "advice" here. I do recall you mentioned you'd been accepted into a medical school, but that means you are not an MD (perhaps yet). I just think it's irresponsible to be doing that.

I know JAMAS is a smart guy, who's very cautious and does lots of research before he makes decisions on any topic. So I know he's not going to blindly take your words as gospel.

I'm all for Freedom of Speech here on our forum, within appropriate bounds. I read all the posts on your supplement thread. No one stopped you from posting about it. But, most importantly, no one was suffering from an acute medical condition at that moment. You don't have all the medical facts, you aren't a doctor, you can't condemn every diagnosis of cholecystitis as bogus and every physician as a scammer or just interested in money. And how in the world would you know if their predecessor was lazy?

Did you ever consider there can be alternate reasons for some of the data you mention (but don't provide citations for)? If there's been a spike in frequency in cholecystectomies, COULD that be because the laproscope has revolutionized abdominal surgery and they can now perform this procedure on more patients than were candidates for the open procedure?
Have you also considered the dramatic increase in morbid obesity as a possible cause for a corresponding increase in lap-choles being performed? Are you aware of the conditions that often contribute to cholecystitis? Are you aware there are numerous differences in the standard of practice/standard of care in medicine between the U.S. and other countries? Does that make one wrong and one right?

I'm not actually looking for answers to these questions, but I list them to give you and other readers some food for thought, when reading such strong statements such as yours.

I have a health care degree, and handled investigation and medical malpractice litigation for over 25 years, so believe me, I've seen, read, discussed, and know about more "adverse occurrences" than you could even possibly think of. I'm also "well versed" in many many medical conditions. Yet, I'd never claim to know or to suggest how JAMAS should proceed. The medical field is so vast, and there always are and always will be varying opinions.

I think it's best we wish JAMAS well, and let him and his medical team decide what's best for him. It's irresponsible and can even be deadly to insert ourselves into a situation where we're not an expert!

[JHarris1385]

Did not link sources because I view this from my phone. (I am sure you can find multiple things on the net). I have hard copies as well.

However by all means get it if you want. I should not have said don't in caps. Furthermore the reason it may or may not be needed is an underlying factor that was never caught in time. Gallbladders are simple and the cells shed and renew at pace faster than other organs. Not going to go into much more as I do not want to direct the attention elsewhere. But I will stand by my personal, and my mentors knowledge.

I hope the best for you Jamas.

[VXIRONwoMAN]

I just gotta say something here...(too long to post everything)

:thumbup: Well said!!!!



JAMAS, I agree with Kat... Do what you and your medical team feel is best for you. We all have our own unique individual experiences. But only you know what you are going through. For example, Last week I whacked the back of my head on a towel rack and still have a headache. I chose not to go to the doctor and diagnosed myself with a mild concussion, took some Tylenol, got some rest and let it heal on its own. Gill's mom and a one of my co-workers had similar incidents and ended up spending over $3k a piece on ER visits, MRI's etc to be told to take some Tylenol and go to bed. If I were vomiting, dizzy, passing out etc I would have gotten professional help. YOU know what is going on in your body, do what you feel will help you best. My only advice would be to definitely get a second maybe even third opinion before doing any kind of surgery. You only have one body.

I hope this helps. Feel better soon!

[Offroad vx]

Don't let people freak you out, you will be sore from the surgery for about a week, it's weird your back will hurt from leaning forward from the incisions. You'll have 4 small insicions one at the top of your stomach, one in your belly button, and 2 for drain tubes. Diet shouldn't change although you may experience a little acid reflux down the road just because the bile has nowhere to go but into your stomach but nothing a Rolaid can't cure. You'll be fine! They even make you go back to work in a week...blah!!!

[Ldub]

I just gotta say something here. I'm troubled by the word "DON'T" in your first post, and "100% Not needed" in your 2nd post, as well as the word "lazy predecessor". I think it's too far over the line to basically be espousing medical "information" and "advice" here. I do recall you mentioned you'd been accepted into a medical school, but that means you are not an MD (perhaps yet). I just think it's irresponsible to be doing that.

I know JAMAS is a smart guy, who's very cautious and does lots of research before he makes decisions on any topic. So I know he's not going to blindly take your words as gospel.

I'm all for Freedom of Speech here on our forum, within appropriate bounds. I read all the posts on your supplement thread. No one stopped you from posting about it. But, most importantly, no one was suffering from an acute medical condition at that moment. You don't have all the medical facts, you aren't a doctor, you can't condemn every diagnosis of cholecystitis as bogus and every physician as a scammer or just interested in money. And how in the world would you know if their predecessor was lazy?

Did you ever consider there can be alternate reasons for some of the data you mention (but don't provide citations for)? If there's been a spike in frequency in cholecystectomies, COULD that be because the laproscope has revolutionized abdominal surgery and they can now perform this procedure on more patients than were candidates for the open procedure?
Have you also considered the dramatic increase in morbid obesity as a possible cause for a corresponding increase in lap-choles being performed? Are you aware of the conditions that often contribute to cholecystitis? Are you aware there are numerous differences in the standard of practice/standard of care in medicine between the U.S. and other countries? Does that make one wrong and one right?

I'm not actually looking for answers to these questions, but I list them to give you and other readers some food for thought, when reading such strong statements such as yours.

I have a health care degree, and handled investigation and medical malpractice litigation for over 25 years, so believe me, I've seen, read, discussed, and know about more "adverse occurrences" than you could even possibly think of. I'm also "well versed" in many many medical conditions. Yet, I'd never claim to know or to suggest how JAMAS should proceed. The medical field is so vast, and there always are and always will be varying opinions.

I think it's best we wish JAMAS well, and let him and his medical team decide what's best for him. It's irresponsible and can even be deadly to insert ourselves into a situation where we're not an expert!


:thumbup: Well said!!!!



JAMAS, I agree with Kat... Do what you and your medical team feel is best for you. We all have our own unique individual experiences. But only you know what you are going through. For example, Last week I whacked the back of my head on a towel rack and still have a headache. I chose not to go to the doctor and diagnosed myself with a mild concussion, took some Tylenol, got some rest and let it heal on its own. Gill's mom and a one of my co-workers had similar incidents and ended up spending over $3k a piece on ER visits, MRI's etc to be told to take some Tylenol and go to bed. If I were vomiting, dizzy, passing out etc I would have gotten professional help. YOU know what is going on in your body, do what you feel will help you best. My only advice would be to definitely get a second maybe even third opinion before doing any kind of surgery. You only have one body.

I hope this helps. Feel better soon!

X2 -X2...:yesgray:

[Ascinder]

Don't let people freak you out, you will be sore from the surgery for about a week, it's weird your back will hurt from leaning forward from the incisions. You'll have 4 small insicions one at the top of your stomach, one in your belly button, and 2 for drain tubes. Diet shouldn't change although you may experience a little acid reflux down the road just because the bile has nowhere to go but into your stomach but nothing a Rolaid can't cure. You'll be fine! They even make you go back to work in a week...blah!!!

My buddy just had his out about a month ago. He had gallstones and what the doctors described as "sludge". The above quote is basically paraphrasing everything he said. I would personally see what the
doctor(s) say about absolutely anything you could do to possibly save and or reverse the situation and consider surgery as a last resort. Doctors are experts, but just because they are doesn't mean they're always right. If that were the case they'd all agree 100% of the time. If it's truly toast, by all means have it out, but if you haven't reached the point of no return, I say fight to keep what's yours!! I'm sure you've heard of all sorts of people trying alternative treatments, some with success and some not, but the point is to at least give it a shot instead of dismissing it as fringe/witch doctor medicine, who knows, it might just save your gallbladder.

[vt_maverick]

Hope your visit with the surgeon went / is going well today. Let us know what you find out!

:luck:

[JHarris1385]

My buddy just had his out about a month ago. He had gallstones and what the doctors described as "sludge". The above quote is basically paraphrasing everything he said. I would personally see what the
doctor(s) say about absolutely anything you could do to possibly save and or reverse the situation and consider surgery as a last resort. Doctors are experts, but just because they are doesn't mean they're always right. If that were the case they'd all agree 100% of the time. If it's truly toast, by all means have it out, but if you haven't reached the point of no return, I say fight to keep what's yours!! I'm sure you've heard of all sorts of people trying alternative treatments, some with success and some not, but the point is to at least give it a shot instead of dismissing it as fringe/witch doctor medicine, who knows, it might just save your gallbladder.


Agree, that was my point. Since the title had the word "might" in it, I safely assumed there is a chance to not have surgery. I may not be an MD just yet but I have enough medical knowledge to give advice. We were made this way for a reason, why should we take a body part out? Like I said, the gallbladder sheds its cells and renews itself at a more rapid pace than others. I have seen many with gb working at 10% or less, find out what is causing the issue and reverse it and thus saving the surgery cost and the loss.

[circmand]

Agree, that was my point. Since the title had the word "might" in it, I safely assumed there is a chance to not have surgery. I may not be an MD just yet but I have enough medical knowledge to give advice. We were made this way for a reason, why should we take a body part out? Like I said, the gallbladder sheds its cells and renews itself at a more rapid pace than others. I have seen many with gb working at 10% or less, find out what is causing the issue and reverse it and thus saving the surgery cost and the loss.

I never had a person who was an MD diagose over the telephone or by internet. My guess is you start doing that when you are an MD you will not be an MD for long.

more than 99% of the time it's a horse

[JHarris1385]

Guess what...I did not diagnose. I gave advice. Trying reading the post and understanding it. NO PART OF THAT WAS DIAGNOSING. THANKS.

[VX KAT]

I may not be an MD just yet but I have enough medical knowledge to give advice.

.....I have seen many with gb working at 10% or less,.....

:_wtf::freek: Are you kidding me? :freek: What about that pesky little thing called a medical degree and a license to legally practice medicine??.....:_thinking BTW, giving advice IS a form of practicing medicine.

I'm curious, where/how would you /have you come across such people (with gb fx @ 10% or so)?

If you're a homeowner, sure hope you bought the umbrella liability coverage....

[JAMAS]

Alright folks....


So I went and talked to my Surgeon. Great guy. Same guy that took my appendix out. I wonder if he is starting a scrap book. So after the blood work yesterday it looks like my levels are ...well, leveling out. Chemically, it looks like my pancreatitis was caused by a gallstone. However, since there isnt any clear and present danger, he was 100% comfortable with me waiting until it becomes an issue. (ie: the pain happens again). The big reason I dont want to do it now is because I did unintentionally fast(not eat) for 4 days cuz I was sick and lost about 10-15 lbs during that time. That might have caused the gallstone. So basically the next time I get a substantial pain and pancreatitis, I will most likely proceed with removing it. You hear that gallbladder....you got a stay of execution....dont mess up.

[VX KAT]

:thumbup: Great to hear JAMAS! And sounds like you really told that GB a thing or two to shape up or he's going to be shipped out!:laugho:

[vt_maverick]

Good to hear Jon! :thumbup:

[Anita]

Sounds like you have a good surgeon there! ;party:

[JAMAS]

Sounds like you have a good surgeon there! ;party:

Yeah he is a good guy. Kinda weird to be 29 and already have a "go to" surgeon.

[Ascinder]

That's really good to hear. Hopefully that fasting was all that caused it to begin with. What did the doc say about reversing/avoiding the situation in the future?

[Anita]

Yeah he is a good guy. Kinda weird to be 29 and already have a "go to" surgeon.

Let's just say from my experience that any surgeon that doesnt jump to cutting is worth closer inspection.

[JAMAS]

That's really good to hear. Hopefully that fasting was all that caused it to begin with. What did the doc say about reversing/avoiding the situation in the future?

There is no reversing the situation. Basically a fully functional perfect gallbladder has enzymes that keep crystallization from happening to form stones. Even when you are fasting, the enzymes should do their job. So mine isnt so perfect. It is possible that while fasting, it allowed the chemicals in my gallbladder to crystallize and form stones. Perhaps on a normal basis, things are moving and flushing enough that it doesnt have time to form. So it is VERY possible that I get another attack down the road. But next time, it will be under normal circumstances and at the point, I will recognize it as an on going problem and take steps to correct it.

[Ebenezr]

OK, now I've got to make a little funny at your expense...hope it gives you a chuckle.......the "usual" patient with gallstones is...the 5 "F"s......Female, Fat, Forty, Fertile and Fair...


"In medical school, the "five F's" help doctors to remember the usual patient with gallbladder disease: "fair, fat, forty, fertile, and female." Sexist as it sounds, it describes the group most frequently affected by gallbladder disease: overweight middle-aged white women with a history of several pregnancies. Excess estrogen may be implicated, since hormone replacement after menopause increases the likelihood of stones."

That's interesting. In veterinary school they teach that the most common signalment for pancreatitis in dogs is fat female five. No kidding.

[VXIRONwoMAN]

Glad the doc doesn't jump to the conclusion that its "gotta come out now". That's good news!
:thumbup:

[VCrossfan]

Sounds like your in good hands....