Need Advice!

[ScubaSteve]

Ok folks.. I'm purchasing a 2001 VX from a dealership in the midwest. I found the vehicle on eBay, and i'm currently the high bidder. I've met the reserve price and contacted the dealer PRIOR to bidding to obtain all the info on the vehicle...

Here's where things started getting messy...

My bid on eBay is significantly lower than they're trying to get out of me on the phone... either way I contacted eBay and was told that they were REQUIRED AND OBLIGATED to sell the truck to me at the bid price. If not I can file complaints against them.

Then, the dealership called me after I offered them a very generous price and also AFTER RUNNING A CREDIT CHECK and said "By the way, not sure if someone told you, but there was $8500 worth of repairs made to the VX..." Yeah... surprisingly no one told me this until the credit check was ran (dont wanna waste their time on someone with bad credit, eh?)

So i demanded paperwork regarding the repairs and wanted verification that it was done by a reliable shop and with Isuzu parts (no insurance company sh*t jobs). Instead, to my shock, they actually had the previous owner call me and we spoke for about 45 minutes about the car... it was then that I found out that he had A/C problems and also wasn't the greatest driver. He also said he caught the tailgate of a truck and bit a 3 inch chunk of body cladding out of the side of the VX...

So naturally I call the dealership and ask again if the car is in good condition -- their response is its in "GREAT condition and looks like new".

"Aside from the chunk behind the psgside rear panel?" I asked?

"Oh.. uh.... well that's barely noticeable..." was their response.

Anyway, they keep feeding me BS about other offers, one of which was a $18995.00 offer (riiiiiiiiiight...) My current offer stands quite a bit lower & they pay shipping.

He just called me back and said there was another offer for slightly more (which means they'll get about $200 less from me bottom line) and said the financing rep was in the parking lot looking over the vehicle. I told him my offer stands at the previous amount - shipping and that i was kicking myself in the *** for even offering that much.

Finally, eBay is telling me to file fraud charges on the auction since they say nothing about the life of the vehicle, and also recommended I contact the better business bureau... I'm wondering if I just wait, see if I get the VX at my price, and then call the owner (got his home ph# off the net) and tell him I would like refunded the price difference between what I paid and what I bid on eBay or I will file fraud charges with eBay (which means they'll be suspended indefinitely from eBay) and also file a complaint with the BBB for misleading advertising, improper selling practices, misrepresentation, unsatisfactory service, and unfulfilled contracts.

Any advice?:mad:

[Pens]

My advice would be to file the complaints and walk away. God only knows what else you are getting into. I understand you want the vehicle but don't be foolish about it.

Oh, and you aren't on Sigforum too are you?

[ScubaSteve]

Sig forum?

[Dallas4u]

Maybe I don't understand clearly, but are the dealership and "owner" different beings here? You said "past owner", then at the end said "owner", and also that you would ask the "owner" for a refund of the price difference... just trying to decypher what is going on.

Now, on to Ebay and the auction. Here's the deal... the auction has to show a description of the car. If the seller holds any info from you, you have the right to back out, plain and simple. That's why, some auctions post "ask any questions before bidding", because once you bid and win, you are obligated to buy the item. If you ask questions and get negative info that wasn't posted in the first place, this could be considered misleading (depending on the info gained) and you then have an option of canceling your bid or keeping it in.

Now, if they are just plain lying in the auction description ("Great condition... looks new!") and you find out it has been wrecked and has pieces missing or whatever, that is fraudulent (be it in the legal sense of the term or just against Ebay rules) and you should not only back out of the auction, but contact Ebay about the act, and the BBB, no doubt about it.

Is this a dealer selling the car on Ebay? How much feedback do they have? How many positives? How many negatives? What type of comments were left from past auctions? Cars are a BIG deal on Ebay and auction sites. That's a lot of money for something you've never seen before! If I didn't feel 100% sure about this deal, or practically any auction I bid on down to a $10 item, I would either not bid, or claim the auction as being somewhat shady.

[ScubaSteve]

sorry... the final "owner" is the owner of the dealership...

i am comfortable with buying the vehicle after talking to the car's previous owner. i'm just not trying to get yanked around, plus they're borderline-breach-of-contract with eBay if they sell the car to anyone but me at anything other than the bid price.

[Anita]

$8500 sounds like more damage than what is described...

Cladding pieces are somewhat affordable and easy to install .. I wonder why they didnt replace it?

Good luck and be careful ;eekr;

[SCUDD]

Hey Steve, If your interested I've got a 2001 KaiserSilver with a few mods and only 14K miles for sale near you. I'm in Gaithersburg MD and the VX is in prfect condition.Let me know and I can email some pics.
Rod
rodanya@yahoo.com

[Dallas4u]

Originally posted by ScubaSteve
plus they're borderline-breach-of-contract with eBay if they sell the car to anyone but me at anything other than the bid price.

Now THIS is DEFINITELY true! I can't believe they are taking outside bids on the vehicle. This should get them thrown off of Ebay, no doubt. If you do decide to keep your bid in, and actually WIN, I wouldn't send them a penny (or even a wooden nickle) until you get something in writing.

[ScubaSteve]

Well get this... they just called me to tell me that the other guy's financing is more or less done and he just got a call from Wells Fargo (financier) who said the check in in the mail. In other words, i missed out on this one.

Ironically, i'm also looking at another internet explorer window in which I'm the highest bidder (and have met the reserve price) on the same vehicle... odd.

Two contracts.
Two people.
One car.... this could get ugly:)

And as it turns out he said they're in the process of getting another VX (01 Yellow) with 24k miles, but it'll cost a little more:) But I could get in on this particular VX if i want!

I passed. Looks pretty possible that I'll be buying SCUDD's especially since's he just an hour or so up the road from me. I've seen from the posts that alot of you have seen SCUDD's VX -- whatcha think? ;pb;

[ScubaSteve]

Oh in case you guys wanna see this particular VX on eBay, here it is:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2427860516&category=6270

ironically what they DON'T tell you is that it was in 2 accidents: one where he hit his daughter's car ramming the bumper through the radiator costing $6000, and then backed into a light pole and needing more work done at the price of $2500.

Also, none of the pics show the bite in the body cladding on the right rear psg side... selective photography...

AND the best part is that I hope they remember to cancel the auction early, 'cause if they don't, eBay takes their auto auctions seriously. I was told by them twice that what they're doing is basis for a breach of contract or a court action to force them to fulfill the contract. Also I was instructed to file a fraud complaint with eBay AND the Better Business Bureau...

Should I even bother with this stuff? I just don't want them to do this BS to another potential customer.

Oh, and if the to-be owner of the aforementioned VX has found this site, welcome and congrats:) We can talk more about the damage to your VX if you'd like... i can put you in contact with the previous owner:)

lastly, the dealership is Jack Miller Subaru (Chryler, GM, Ford, etc..... huge chain) of Kansas City/Olathe/etc.;eekr;

[Dallas4u]

I would say yes, you need to file complaints with both Ebay and the BBB... it doesn't take long.

Funny, they've "been in business for 35 years", and they've done a "152 point inspection has been done here at the dealership to make sure that there is nothing wrong with car car", so I would consider that fraud. They've been doing business for long enough to know what they are doing, and to know that lying to sell a car is against the law, yet they still do it.

I guaran-damn-tee you, if I bid $18k on the VX right now, they would contact me, finance me, and get me in that thing ASAP. They doesn't fly, and they should pay for those types of practices.

[Vasha13]

I agree - you definitely need to file with ebay and the better business bureau. It's a wonderful thing owning a VX but getting a 'tainted' one without knowing would just sour the whole ownership. Definitely follow up on the reporting.

[AREA 51]

Usually it's posted in plain english, by the seller, that they "reserve the right to end the auction early due to the item also being offered off of epay" to avoid exactly this kind of problem.

If that isn't expressly shown, then I would think they'd be legally obligated to sell to the winning bidder.

That being said, I recall another member here who bought some wheels . He paid , never received the item and then the wheels were re-listed and resold again to someone else!

It was a mess and still may not be sorted out.

If you intend to pursue any action keep a record of all contacts and all documentation, Keep all emails. Find out where you have to file legal or other complaints because the jurisdiction may be cost and /or time prohibitive.

I'm sure you can find a nicer one out there.

My advice: RUN--- DON'T WALK away from this one

[Anita]

Thank your :angel: that that one passed by... File your complaints and thanks for the 'heads up' on that dealership.


By all means go and see Scudd's VX!
But Scudd, sorry to see you sell your baby.

[ScubaSteve]

nowhere on the listing does it even MENTION that the vehicle is up for sale by any means other than eBay. They're on the verge of breach of contract, and when it happens i plan to burn them.;Dr;

[Joe_Black]

Definitely don't get something that isn't in your comfort zone. Also take advantage of your compatriots here on the board and see if anyone is near a potential purchase to go take a looksee. Also check CarMax and see what they have since you can take it back in 5 days if it's a dud.

I've sold and purchased several vehicles on eBay and you really need to do your homework, pop the $20 for a full CarFax (they have a guarantee) and check feedback. Deals can be had, just just screw yourself with impatience.

[johnnyapollo]

Hey Steve,

I've been working with eBay auctions pretty much since the beginning (I'm in the biz). If the seller closes the auction early (easy to do - he just needs to use the "error in the listing" reason), he's under no obligation to sell it to you. It's very common practice and all they are out is $45 for the listing fee.

I'm expecting the auction to close any time now (if the other offer is "real" that is). If I were you, I would walk away from this one and forget side-step all the hassle.

My 2 cents - John

[WyrreJ]

Don't waste your time on the Better Business Bureau - they are a scam with PR better than DeBeers's. Just follow the money - all BBB's are funded 100% by member merchants, if you file a complaint against a current member, the BBB will do all it can to make sure the complaint ends up in the circular file in 6 months or less - one or two of those steps involve a half-hearted attempt to fix things, but most of it is just procedural jerking you around. If the merchant is not a member of the BBB, they will probably use your complaint as extortion to get the merchant to join, as in "if you don't join, then this complaint will become public record, but if you do join, we'll squash it like we do for all the other members."

Ebay I don't know so well wrt to car dealers, but in general ebay sides with sellers and not buyers because it is the sellers who pay ebay.

[Dallas4u]

The auction is now not found (error on the page).

[Pens]

I am not sure, but I think that EBAY feels that their buyers are pretty important too, since if nobody purchased anything, people would not post items for sale. EBAY will drop those guys like a hot rock to try to save their good name, which is their most important resource when selling on the internet.

[SGT.BATGUANO]

I'm having trouble accessing lots of stuff on epay right now?

[Dallas4u]

Well, for what ever reason the auction is over, it seems they took all of the bids off that went over the reserve, and brought the price back down to below the reserve price. Like Ebay doesn't keep a record of that.

[ScubaSteve]

Well, I filled eBay in on the whole story. They said "wow... I can't believe they did that:)"

Contemplating on calling the BBB but from WyrreJ says, might not be much of a point...

Wish there was a way to contact the guy that actually bought the vehicle...

any of you like in the Kansas City/Olathe area? Maybe if you see a black 01 VX toolin' around town you can mention for him to check out this post...

[Anita]

Steve,

Now onward for to purchase your VX! :luck: